Matrix - Game Thread

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I'm not entirely sure I remembered that about you, but okay :laugh:

I wasn't being shady, I think you're a wolf, I was explaining to Clem what I thought your motive would be under those circumstances. It's not really shade when I'm being direct about my read on you?
Let's pretend we're living in a world where I was NK'd last night and flipped village. Or better yet, I'm IC and confirmed town. All I've seen so far is you tunneling me and saying you need more info on other people. Other than me, what's your PoE?

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(Jk it makes sense, I was young and arrogant too)
Meh, young Stagg was a wild and crazy wolf that ruined villages. Old Stagg doesn't have time for that crap and even if I did the vets all know that a vote for Stagg isn't wrong even late game. I'm not as good as I was, but I've still only ever lost one online game as a wolf (when not subbed out D1), and I don't count it as a loss since the living wolf accidentally started their wolf brag a cycle early when living village all saw them as hard-cleared (and it was a 3P win anyway, Dina forever wins that game).
 
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The imo the odds of a claim


I'll happily switch to you if I feel like Moon's claim gains legitimacy. I don't think I read you well but you're setting off all kinds of flags for me this game.


This is shady shade-throwing shadeballz af. You know I get lost in mechanics and like solving puzzle games and I wouldn't be trying to fish for this info.


This is true. Side note, why are we assuming actions are soft? Certainly could be but if it's not stated in the rules I won't assume it.


Not yet, but there are definitely solid inferences that can be made. Ie, we know 2/3 mafia roles (blocker and goon). We know that if there's a mafia watcher then they know 100% there's a doctor, so we're less likely playing column A or row 2. We also know that at this point mafia can't know 100% that there isn't a town doctor unless actions are loud and they have info from someone acting on them. We also know the only setups without a town doctor are Columns B and C or rows 3 or 4. So more than likely there is an odd night doctor.

If Moon is a wolf going down and pack wants to eliminate a PR, doctor is their best bet at a counter claim. If no one counterclaims, then Moon can potentially coast. If someone does, they lose a wolf (possibly goon) but also take down a PR. If wolves are trying to survive with an untaken PR, then doctor claim probably wasn't a great choice. Other way to look at it though is that town doc flip also keeps the wolf PRs more hidden, as it has the most combinations for game set up. So in wolfy Moon world I think it just depends on how worried they would be that she would be going down. If they really thought she was screwed then claiming doc gives the best chance of finding a PR while also hiding their roles. However, it's also the PR claim at greatest risk of getting counterclaimed as there's a 60% chance of town doctor being present in the game while every other role only has a 40% chance independently.
They’re soft in the MU champ game. I got confused last year because of it.

Village will never know the set up based on the mafia, they don’t flip with roles. Just an fyi
 
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Alright, I caught up, but I was hoping to get the spreadsheet done and posted, and I'm not quite there yet. (I should really figure out how Nate automates things, I'm silly enough to do it all manually.) Hopefully I'll have more time for that tonight/early tomorrow.

In the meantime, this is where I'm at:

Zenge
Achro

samac & Dubz

Clem J
PSV
Santy

mayo/marmot
genny
Stagg737

Gikkle
Shinichi

Sorry to drop a list and run, but I'll answer any questions when I can.
 
Let's pretend we're living in a world where I was NK'd last night and flipped village. Or better yet, I'm IC and confirmed town. All I've seen so far is you tunneling me and saying you need more info on other people. Other than me, what's your PoE?
Achro, Clem, PSV, Shinichi, mayo --> marmot
 
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Hi I am marmot and most definitely am not a doctor.

I have beer plans this evening but I'll come in later and vote for a wolf. Wish me luck!!
 
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Good morning everyone. At least, for me lol.

I see Moon is posting this is good.
 
Hi I am marmot and most definitely am not a doctor.

I have beer plans this evening but I'll come in later and vote for a wolf. Wish me luck!!
So you dont cc the odd night doctor claim of moon?

Just making sure you're aware of what the question was.

And good luck go get drunk and have fun
 
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Anyway it's day 2 and now I am sad, so its time to eat someone

@WildZoo why am I like, your second most suspicious person?
 
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@Achromatic current thoughts on moon?

Claiming doctor day 1 when they did and also calling me very towny doesn't feel like an evil scum plot to me. I'd expect a scum moon to cry about me suspecting them and to murder me with the doctor mandate

does tell me scum is kinda silly if moon is in fact town tho
 
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Hi I am marmot and most definitely am not a doctor.

I have beer plans this evening but I'll come in later and vote for a wolf. Wish me luck!!

So you dont cc the odd night doctor claim of moon?

Just making sure you're aware of what the question was.

And good luck go get drunk and have fun
Yes I guess I didn’t make that clear lol
Moon claimed doc. Mayo wasn’t around. Just wanted to make sure we weren’t letting her coast
 
If however we want to assume moon wolf for a moment, the problem I have is you thought we were partnered which is not correct so if you have any other good partner ideas for moon I'd like to hear them.
 
I think Santy (?) mentioned this already but in case it wasn't stated as a question, I do want to know what you meant by this...like how was moon playing like a scared kitten?

Sure.

So the last time I played with Moon they were pretty inquisitive and prodding in how they talked with people, from memory. Here I felt like they were just like leaving me alone a lot and not really curious about my motives or anything.

i don't like it when people aren't curious about me by nature, as I am a bit of an infamously strong wolf for those who have seen my wolf game. You don't exactly beat me by playing passive as moon did.
 
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It just occurs to me that put down has two different meanings.

I didn't mean stop using, I meant write it out.
 
okay then I will just never listen to you lol.

If you can't show your work then uh, well par for the course from you tbh
1, you already don't listen to me, this is new how? 2, I already did it, keep reading
 
It's also just not that  that hard to figure out tbh
 
I listen to everyone, I just sometimes end up disagreeing smh
 
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I mean I'm familiar with the concept of PRs acting sketchy and that getting misread as scuminess but that description just didn't feel like it fit with moon's play

I also don't think Achro answered my question about the "classically wolfy" comment on Zenge but I also said I would find it if they'd said already and then I had to skim again so that might be my fault
I did already explain btw
 
@marmot` HI
ARE YOU THE DOCTOR
I think this is acceptable fishing given thread state/claims.

If someone is a motion detector I’d like to know what you learned. It’s worth the share I think.
This is not acceptable fishing and I feel the need to call this out. This is not helping you move out of my scum reads...

Can you clarify on achro again? I can’t remember
I vibe with a lot of Santy's argument. I had Achro in the same pile as PSV and Shinichi (ie enough info to be good, but not sure where I stand) but Santy gave a solid argument. Other things were that I wasn't a fan of the sudden backing off of Zenge, then voting for Moon after the weird interaction between them, then unvoting Moon and almost immediately following me onto MKG. I just don't like the progression of their actions yesterday. Plus, Achro flip would give a good amount of info I think. Then again so could Shini, but at this point I think Santy's argument for Achro is better than Zenge's for Shini and for now I've got Santy higher on my village list than Zenge.

Village will never know the set up based on the mafia, they don’t flip with roles. Just an fyi
This is a valid point that I missed, not sure it affects my view too much atm though.
 
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Day 2 Yeet Tally
Shini (2)
- Zenge 9, moon 20
Clem () -
Achro (1) - Santy 51
Stagg (2)
- Dubz 34, samac 34
moon (2)
- Stagg 22, Clem 36

7/13
yeet close in ~26.5 hours
 
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oh is santy trying to kill me?

guess santy is wolfing then that's sad
 
vote: Achromatic

my legacy is to murder the **** out of santy

reading up on why space might have been n1'd now
 
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Day 2 Yeet Tally
Shini (2)
- Zenge 9, moon 20
Clem () -
Achro (1) - Santy 51
Stagg (2)
- Dubz 34, samac 34
moon (2)
- Stagg 22, Clem 36

7/13
yeet close in ~26.5 hours
Clem (soon to be 37)

I think we're gonna do it fam
 
@Stagg737 still would like clarity what this post is quoting was supposed to say pls
The imo the odds of a claim
I was going to say the odds of a claim being a wolf claim are actually >50% because they'd have more knowledge about potential game set up based on knowing all their roles, but that's bad math and I forgot my brain wandered to other quotes.
 
Claiming doctor day 1 when they did and also calling me very towny doesn't feel like an evil scum plot to me. I'd expect a scum moon to cry about me suspecting them and to murder me with the doctor mandate

does tell me scum is kinda silly if moon is in fact town tho
Murder you with the doctor mandate how?
 
If however we want to assume moon wolf for a moment, the problem I have is you thought we were partnered which is not correct so if you have any other good partner ideas for moon I'd like to hear them.

Im not actively looking for partners because we dont have the flip yet. Like, I dont think they are unaligned with most of the players here
 
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Hrm. I am thinking the scum may have believed space was softing pr when they discussed not believing pr claims readily when moon claimed doctor. If not then my zenge read may be bogus as he died suspecting him.
 
Sure.

So the last time I played with Moon they were pretty inquisitive and prodding in how they talked with people, from memory. Here I felt like they were just like leaving me alone a lot and not really curious about my motives or anything.

i don't like it when people aren't curious about me by nature, as I am a bit of an infamously strong wolf for those who have seen my wolf game. You don't exactly beat me by playing passive as moon did.

And how do you feel about being the second most confident townread of moon?

To me it seems like the doctor claim made magically all your Paranoia disappear now?
 
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But given setup I am ~guessing~ mafia got greedy, roleblocked the doctor (I think doctor is odd nights from memory, I could look but meh) and thought this was maybe hinting pr and missed

space was also obv town

so probably says little about zenge
 
vote: Achromatic

my legacy is to murder the **** out of santy

reading up on why space might have been n1'd now
Wat? I'm confused about the self vote, is there some non-SDN meaning behind a self-vote?

You also realize quite a few people have you in their wolf-leans list, right?
 
oh is santy trying to kill me?

guess santy is wolfing then that's sad
How so? I'm trying to figure you out and using my vote for that.

F.e. Im a bit wierded out that you enter into the thread with no comment about psv, which at EoD entered into thread and was trying to CFD you
 
And how do you feel about being the second most confident townread of moon?

To me it seems like the doctor claim made magically all your Paranoia disappear now?
It's not magic, it's basic game solving.

Most day 1 claims come from town (I dont know clem's math, I'll look at it when i see it) and killing protection is very low ev in my experience. The game should be solvable from the binary of moon is either scum or town and looking at the game through that lens
 
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Wat? I'm confused about the self vote, is there some non-SDN meaning behind a self-vote?

You also realize quite a few people have you in their wolf-leans list, right?

Sure, so go ahead and kill me for the info

and then murder santy in particular.
 
Also I havent seen any PSV posts today, I have no reason to comment on them yet.
 
It's not magic, it's basic game solving.

Most day 1 claims come from town (I dont know clem's math, I'll look at it when i see it) and killing protection is very low ev in my experience. The game should be solvable from the binary of moon is either scum or town and looking at the game through that lens
Mafia will always fakeclaim when they are on moon's position. The setup allows for mafia to do it and either force a counterclaim, or if that role isnt on the setup, no town would be able to tell at first. So its always optimal to claim if you are mafia, or truly the PR
 
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