Partnership negotiation

[creek]

I have been working for my current practice for two years and ready to negotiate partnership.

Our practice is multi specialty, has PCP, urgent care etc. so it is complicated...

My Qs:
- what office collection% to ask?
- what ASC facility fee% is appropriate to ask?
- Should I ask for certain percentage of ownership for the pain clinic itself?

Any insights would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!

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[drusso]

I have been working for my current practice for two years and ready to negotiate partnership.

Our practice is multi specialty, has PCP, urgent care etc. so it is complicated...

My Qs:
- what office collection% to ask?
- what ASC facility fee% is appropriate to ask?
- Should I ask for certain percentage of ownership for the pain clinic itself?

Any insights would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!

Uh...back this up. I would be asking for:

1) A CPA review of the owner/shareholder comp methodology
2) 2 years worth of financial statements
3) A copy of the by-laws and last 2 years of annual shareholder meeting minutes
4) A copy of the buy-sell agreement
5) A copy of the most recent valuation

 

[Bostonspine]

I have been working for my current practice for two years and ready to negotiate partnership.

Our practice is multi specialty, has PCP, urgent care etc. so it is complicated...

My Qs:
- what office collection% to ask?
- what ASC facility fee% is appropriate to ask?
- Should I ask for certain percentage of ownership for the pain clinic itself?

Any insights would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!

Did they offer partnership? What does that mean? Are you buying shares of the ASC or Shares of the cooperation? Are there super partners? As noted above how is the value of the determine? What is your ROI? Is being a partner beneficial? Who really owns the group physicians, joint partnership, private equity?

 

[Ferrismonk]

Yeah, the questions you are asking for are more of employee questions.

Buying into a partnership is buying into a business. You need to understand it's value, what your buying, and if the price is worth the return on investment. Both in time and money.

 

[RoloTomassi]

- what office collection% to ask?

As a partner, compensation is usually your collections minute overhead. %collections would be a formula for an employee.

- what ASC facility fee% is appropriate to ask?

ASC profit would be distributed by percent ownership, independent of individual production.

 

[creek]

Thank you everyone!

There are two superpartners. However they manage the clinic, they do not work. They do marketing and drive business as this is multi specialty group. This location is just their branch clinic in different cities. I am among the first two local joined pain doctors. They promised partnership at the beginning. I am base + collectiom bonus.

The clinic is producing good revenue.

Apparently I can not just do collection - overhead formula as this left nothing for super partners. My goal is to increase my collection. They are talking about selling clinic after a few years when it’s big... I am just thinking to avoid losing job, better get certain ownership of the pain clinic as early as possible...

I am working a lot more harder than the other doc, most of the revenue is generated by me.

 

[Agast]

Is it typical to negotiate the terms of partnership after you’ve already been working there? Our contract already outlines/defines the process towards partnership and what it entitled you to.

Hard to negotiate now in the sense that your leverage is whether it’s worth it to you to leave.

Since you cannot become a Super Partner I think the next step is sometimes described as Shareholder(?) as you can never truly be equal in your current set up

 

[drusso]

What's a Super-Partner? Asking for a friend...

 

[anonperson]

What's a Super-Partner? Asking for a friend...

The actual bosses who generate no real revenue but make sure to collect a fat paycheck off the worker bee physicians.

 

[drusso]

The actual bosses who generate no real revenue but make sure to collect a fat paycheck off the worker bee physicians.

Sounds fun! How do you become a Super-Partner?

 

[Bostonspine]

Thank you everyone!

There are two superpartners. However they manage the clinic, they do not work. They do marketing and drive business as this is multi specialty group. This location is just their branch clinic in different cities. I am among the first two local joined pain doctors. They promised partnership at the beginning. I am base + collectiom bonus.

The clinic is producing good revenue.

Apparently I can not just do collection - overhead formula as this left nothing for super partners. My goal is to increase my collection. They are talking about selling clinic after a few years when it’s big... I am just thinking to avoid losing job, better get certain ownership of the pain clinic as early as possible...

I am working a lot more harder than the other doc, most of the revenue is generated by me.

The super partners compensation is part of you overhead they just don’t want to share that they are skimming 10-20% off the top. Sounds like they Will sell to private equity once you work hard enough to improve there EBITA. Also you probably won’t loose your job if they sell as they will be selling you future earning potential.

 

[drusso]

The super partners compensation is part of you overhead they just don’t want to share that they are skimming 10-20% off the top. Sounds like they Will sell to private equity once you work hard enough to improve there EBITA. Also you probably won’t loose your job if they sell as they will be selling you future earning potential.

How do you become a Super-Partner? Do you work your ass off and go balls to wall for years or decades or do you just calling yourself that?

 

[Ferrismonk]

In general, super-partners maintain voting/veto rights and other forms of control not available to lesser partners. Depending on the setup, they may also get a higher cut of the profits than lesser partners. In my experience, there is no way to be a super-partner unless you founded the company.

For Creek, unfortunately we cannot give you great advice without knowing the partnership setup. This is highly variable. Is it one company or multiple companies under one umbrella? What does partnership even really mean? Do you have an equal share of the company and all it's ancillaries or just partial ownership of the pain clinic and/or ASC? If your part gets sold, what do you get? You really need to see what they're actually offering and go over it with a lawyer.

 

[SSdoc33]

How do you become a Super-Partner? Do you work your ass off and go balls to wall for years or decades or do you just calling yourself that?

you wear a cape over your scrubs. duh

 

[drusso]

In general, super-partners maintain voting/veto rights and other forms of control not available to lesser partners. Depending on the setup, they may also get a higher cut of the profits than lesser partners. In my experience, there is no way to be a super-partner unless you founded the company.

For Creek, unfortunately we cannot give you great advice without knowing the partnership setup. This is highly variable. Is it one company or multiple companies under one umbrella? What does partnership even really mean? Do you have an equal share of the company and all it's ancillaries or just partial ownership of the pain clinic and/or ASC? If your part gets sold, what do you get? You really need to see what they're actually offering and go over it with a lawyer.

...but can Super-Partners cast Fireballs?

 

[cowboydoc]

...but can Super-Partners cast Fireballs?

View attachment 356724

perception vs. reality…

 

[MitchLevi]

"Super Partner" - I built this practice 30 yrs ago, and now I'm part time and you work for me...Don't forget I took all the risk up front, not you.

 

[RoloTomassi]

I know a practice like that. Super partner started it, sold 40% to associate, non-voting shares. SP weaned down to 1/2 day a week, still keeping 60% of profits and full control.

 

[Yo GabbaPentin]

Only way to super partner status is to own the private equity group that buys out the current super partners.

 

[nvrsumr]

Docs would rather the fruits of their labor go to the distant Mba PE guys or the faceless hospital admin than the “super partner” that didn’t take a paycheck for a year to start the practice. Envy is is part of the lizard brain

 

[drusso]

Docs would rather the fruits of their labor go to the distant Mba PE guys or the faceless hospital admin than the “super partner” that didn’t take a paycheck for a year to start the practice. Envy is is part of the lizard brain

Woh. Nailed it. That's the next Tat that the Pain Surgeon-Super-Partner-KOL are going to be sporting at ASPN this year...

 

[creek]

Super partner is a rare breed, they do have the vision and dedication to build from scratch.

My goal is to become a small partner just for the pain clinic I am working. This way I will continue to be part of it even after they sell it so I can enjoy the fruit that I planted.

 

[SandmanMD]

Sounds fun! How do you become a Super-Partner?

1. Ability to take revenue from worker bee physician at the speed of light.

2. Ability to disguise the lack of actual revenue generation

3. Ability to make worker bee think it’s worth having a partner who doesn’t do the physical work.

4. A cool method or transportation, a good costume and some kind of mask.

 

[drusso]

1. Ability to take revenue from worker bee physician at the speed of light.

2. Ability to disguise the lack of actual revenue generation

3. Ability to make worker bee think it’s worth having a partner who doesn’t do the physical work.

4. A cool method or transportation, a good costume and some kind of mask.

You forgot the tattoo.

 

[SandmanMD]

You forgot the tattoo.

Damn. You’re right! Definitely need a tattoo.