Midwest Programs...NOT a "help me rank"

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Parrothead

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Since this forum seems to be dominated by the east and west coast, I was hoping to get a little Midwest love going on. It seems the only Midwest programs that ever get spoken about are Mich, Wash U, Mayo, UofC, NW.

My question is, what are people's thoughts on other Midwest programs? Specifically, how are these programs perceived in regards to academic reputation in the Midwest and outside the Midwest? Are they all about equal, or are there some major differences? Again, not looking for help in a rank order list, there are way too many other individual preferences that go in to that decision.

How about these...U Wisconsin, U Minnesota, U Iowa, Indiana U, Rush, Loyola, UIC. Or if anyone has any others, go ahead, throw them in too.

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Here are my quick one-line opinions on each to try to start some conversation...these are only the progams I have visited

UMich--Malignant, but probably the most respected academically in the MW.

Mayo--Strong, very academic slant, quality of residents hurt by Rochester.
? malignancy level here--hard to get a feel for.

WashU--Once again, very academic, old-school, but much less malignant
than UMich. Probably 2nd most respected in midwest.

NW--Most "academic" program I was at in Chicago (only went to two, though, here and Loyola).

Wisconsin--I think this is a solid progam with strong leadership. Does surprisingly well with fellowship placement.

Iowa--New leadership team in last 2-3 years. Seems to be on the way up.

Indiana--Would place a notch below Iowa and Wisconsin as far as reputation. Thought Indy was OK, though.

UMN--Hospital has been through financial struggles--not something I want to deal with.

Anyone else???
 
Nephrons said:
I do not feel the midwest programs draw the same caliber of applicants the west and east coast programs get.

Personally, I do not think that this makes a program any weaker. Just because a program doesnt attract stronger applicants does not necessarily make it a weaker program. The strength of the program depends on the quality of education, which is provided by the faculty, not the other residents. Take Mayo for example. Rochester, MN may possibly be the worst place on earth. However, the doctors there are among the best in the country.

If you are from the Midwest, I think that this makes these programs more desireable since you have a better chance of getting accepted into a solid program. Plus, many programs like to keep their own residents as fellows. From what I have been told, programs realize that a fellow is not going to "make" the program, because if the fellow is that good, they will leave after fellowship anyways. Fellowships are often given to intelligent people that work hard and are easy to work with. Because of this, a program would rather keep a person whom they know demostrates these characteristics rather than an unknown entity who may turn out to be a total bust.

I am from the midwest and do not really plan on applying out of the midwest. I may never be able to say I spent my 3 days off a month surfing or mountain climbing, but in the end I would rather be at a good program in the midwest over a mediocre program out east or west.
 
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AMPAD said:
Here are my quick one-line opinions on each to try to start some conversation...these are only the progams I have visited

UMich--Malignant, but probably the most respected academically in the MW.

WashU--Once again, very academic, old-school, but much less malignant
than UMich. Probably 2nd most respected in midwest.

The identity of the most respected program in the Midwest is very debatable. Rather than rehash what has already been posted, I leave this link as a counterpoint. Draw your own conclusions.

http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=167168&page=1

The focus of this thread was to compare the other Midwest programs (U Wisconsin, U Minnesota, MCW, CWRU, U Iowa, Indiana U, Rush, Loyola, UIC). Let us hear the voices of residents and students who are from these institutions.
 
"The focus of this thread was to compare the other Midwest programs (U Wisconsin, U Minnesota, MCW, CWRU, U Iowa, Indiana U, Rush, Loyola, UIC). Let us hear the voices of residents and students who are from these institutions."

Well said. Does anyone else have anything to offer? There's gotta be more people out there with interest in the Midwest or input on these programs. What kind of financial troubles did Minnesota have? I wasn't aware of this.
 
"How about these...U Wisconsin, U Minnesota, U Iowa, Indiana U, Rush, Loyola, UIC. Or if anyone has any others, go ahead, throw them in too.[/QUOTE]

Re: the above schools...only interviewed at 2 of them.

U of Wisconsin- Possibly the strongest program (in regards to pure training) on your mentioned list. As another person posted, their program director is amazing. I had heard that he was even consulted by another midwest program (Indiana?) a few yrs ago to help them revamp their own program. Busy hospital with strong teaching. Good fellowship placement afterwards as well. Madison is supposedly the Berkley of the Midwest, and the PD's pony tail and long beard only help confirm that idea.

Indiana U- Great program, especially if you're thinking of going into primary care (I was told top 10 in that area). Probably the biggest sleeper program in the Midwest. Residents work at 4 or 5 hospitals that provide a wide variety of training and cases. I believe they have a strong interest in international medicine (emphasis in Africa). Notable fellowship placement as well.


Other midwest schools to consider...

Case Western- Another strong program that is under-rated due to their location. As I heard numerous times during my interview trail last yr...if you're going to be in Cleveland, do your residency at Case and your fellowship at CCF. Academic wise, they may have the best reputation on this list (maybe tied w/ UofWisconsin). Really liked the residents.

The Ohio State U- I'll probably be flogged for admitting this, but I loved OSU. Case Western and OSU were my first 2 interviews last yr and I would have been very happy with either program. Their PD is a fairly recent addition but was great. I truly enjoyed the faculty that I met. No VA system but they work w/ a lot of prisoners (not saying that the 2 groups are the same :p) From their list last yr, it looked like the majority stayed on afterwards for fellowships.
 
MidwestMD said:
"No VA system but they work w/ a lot of prisoners (not saying that the 2 groups are the same)

:laugh:
 
Here's some info I know about the U of M. As for finacial trouble, I don't know who is spreading that rumor, but it is false. Roughly 10 years ago, the Uniiversity hopsital was bought by Fairview a company that owns a lot of hospitals in the state. I imagine finacial difficulty was a big reason, but as of now, there's no problem. I thought the program was awesome and even did a second look there. The PD and Chair of Medicine are very invovled. The Chair sits down with each incoming intern and helps them create a plan to get into fellowships (specailty, not location). He puts you in contact with people in the specialties of your choice within the university. The program is mid-size roughly 26 I think. They have 3 sites you rotate through, the university hospital, Regions which is the county hospital in St. Paul and the VA. The VA is the nicest I've ever seen. It is nicer than my home university's hospital. The residents are very cool and seem really bright. I didn't even think Minnesota was on my map for residency because I had horrible interactions with them while applying to medical school. Right now it's in my top 3 with Mayo-Rochester and Wash U.
 
I am not from the midwest, but my wife has family in the midwest so I have been primarily looking at some of the midwest programs talked about here. Here are a few brief thoughts, for what they are worth...

U. of Minnesota -
Was not very high on the program prior to the interview, but was very impressed during the interview day. The residents were all very enthusiastic about the program, and the program director/faculty seemed to radiate the feeling that everyone and everything was headed in the right direction. Did not hear much about whether or not the hospital was in the red/black, etc, but that really didn't come up. I have been to Minneapolis a few times, and think it's a great city.

U. of Wisconsin -
Madison is a VERY excellent town. I think I loved the city so much that it may skew my opinion slightly, but I also thought the program was very nice. The university hospital is very nice, and I liked how it was linked directly to the VA. The morning report I attended was very well run, informative, and the residents really seemed on top of the topics discussed.

U. of Iowa -
Iowa City is actually a very cool town, but it certainly is small. Good college town, however. I had mixed feelings about the program. For whatever reason I was put off by the resident I sat next to at the dinner. However, the residents I met the next day were friendly. The hospital is enormous, which I actually don't prefer. It never seems to end, but nevertheless it is very nice. The program itself seemed solid and well-rounded. I guess I just didn't have a great feeling there, maybe it was simply my mood on that day.

U. of Michigan -
The hospital is pleasant, and the residents were quite friendly, for the most part (with the exception of this genuine a%$hole at dinner the night before, which everyone at my table agreed). Solid reputation, and research certainly seemed stressed. The size of each class is large, but the residents indicated that it was relatively cohesive regardless. Probably should have had more sleep the night before, because the interviews were late in the afternoon, and we sat through about 16 conferences in the morning, including a bullish grand rounds that left about 80-85% of the applicants asleep. It was quite humorous actually. All joking aside, the feeling was that you would without a doubt get excellent training there and would have your pick of quality fellowships. Ann Arbor is another very pleasant college town, somewhat similar to Iowa City in a few ways.

Case Western/University Hospitals -
I liked this program very much. Residents were cool and relaxed. Fellowship placements were quite nice, as I wasn't terribly familiar with the program going into the interview. The facilities you tour are gorgeous, although you certainly don't get to see the "older" half of the hosptial, and we also didn't get a tour of the VA on the day I interviewed. I really didn't find any overt negatives at all. The program director was cracking jokes left and right during morning report, which was actually somewhat refreshing... there was still plenty of knowledge going around, though.

Ohio State University -
Cool residents. Liked Columbus quite a bit. No VA system, but like one user pointed out, at least you hang out with the prison population! People certainly get fellowships if they want them, and many of them do stay on at OSU to do theirs (which is viewed as a pro or con depending on how you look at it). The facility is solid, and the faculty (so I am told) are known for their teaching. Smaller-sized class (18 or so categorical residents annually). Doesn't seem to have the reputation of some of the other more well-known programs, but I got the feeling that it was nevertheless quite the hotbed of research and there certainly no shortage of very sick patients. If you dig cardiology (which I don't) their new heart hospital is extremely impressive, and James Cancer Hospital is also very well known. The program seemd on solid ground, and the fairly new program director certainly is enthusiastic and doesn't seem like one to rest on her/the program's laurels.

Frankly, for a handful of reasons, I'm planning on ranking Ohio State quite high. Does anyone else have thoughts about OSU either from their interview days or if they're actually currently a resident there? I'm always curious as to what others thought as well... or any of these programs for that matter.

Good luck to everyone.
 
Red58 said:
Here's some info I know about the U of M. As for finacial trouble, I don't know who is spreading that rumor, but it is false.

On my interview day, the chief whisked us by the CCU and said it was temporarily closed "for financial reasons" and that it would hopefully be up and running by Jan 1st. Not sure if it is now running or not.
 
I assume the U of M in purported financial trouble is Michigan. I didn't interview there, but a closed CCU doesn't necessarily mean that the hospital is in dire straits. It could just be that the residents and attendings are managing potential CCU players on the floor and that for resource management issues it isn't worth opening the unit if people continue to ignore it. I offer this because my home institution is a very profitable hospital that has experienced this phenomenon (to the frustration of the CCU director) in the past.
 
How is the U of Pittsburgh fit into in this discussion? Any opionion or anyone who went there for interview? All of their IM subspecialities are very strong and highly-rated. Thanks in advance.
 
No more thoughts on midwest programs?? Anyone??
 
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bicycle said:
I assume the U of M in purported financial trouble is Michigan. I didn't interview there, but a closed CCU doesn't necessarily mean that the hospital is in dire straits. It could just be that the residents and attendings are managing potential CCU players on the floor and that for resource management issues it isn't worth opening the unit if people continue to ignore it. I offer this because my home institution is a very profitable hospital that has experienced this phenomenon (to the frustration of the CCU director) in the past.


Michigan absolutely has no financial trouble. None, none, none. Totally in the black.
 
you guys forgot Rush???
 
I went to med school at Indiana, and am now a PG-1 at Wisconsin, so I can talk a bit about both of those programs.

Indiana: Definately a solid program, and I'm glad I went there for med school. Residents rotate at 4 hospitals, including a VA, a county/indigent hospital, a university tertiary referral center hospital and a large community hospital. Very strong in primary care with opportunities for rotations in Kenya if you want them. Main drawbacks are that your fellow residents are spread out so you may not see them for months at a time, and there is a fairly large proportion of FMG's (this can be both an advantage and disadvantage, of course.)

Wisconsin: It was tough to leave Indiana, but I'm glad that I did and came to Wisconsin. I feel like I'm getting top-notch training here. The PD is definately one of the great draws of the program for residents. Madison is also a very fun and easy city to live in. The "Berkeley of the Midwest" comment is pretty apt.
 
Thanks to everyone for some great posts.

Anyone else out there have any other thoughts?

Anyone else having a hard time tossing back and forth between a few of these places?
 
Anyone decided how they plan to rank some of these midwest programs? Programs I will be ranking include:

THE Ohio State University
U. of Wisconsin
U. of Minnesota
U. of Michigan
Case Western/University Hospitals
U. of Iowa
 
I can tell you that the program director is beyond a doubt the reason why many of the residents choose to go to the University of Wisconsin. He is an outstanding clinician and teacher and most importantly he is a great person. He has the residents’ best interests at heart always. He attends on the general med wards as well as on the ID consult service so there is ample time to work with him individually. If you were to talk with the residents you would uniformly hear nothing but positives about him. The Internal Med department is involved with many clinical trials and other basic research. There is no problem with getting involved with research at Wisconsin. The University Medical Center has an attached VA hospital, which is nice since it affords residents working at the VA hospital access to the didactics and other happenings at the University Hospital. There is a new Medical School that is also attached to the Hospital (huge library) and attached to the med school there is a new pharm school. New peds hospital is being constructed so the floors currently occupied by the peds hospital will be used to increase medical beds. Residents do well for fellowships and over last 7 years only one has not passed the boards. I could continue on but I think I have made my point.
 
Just bumping this thread to the top. I've already posted a few, so hopefully we can get some more info.

Come on, folks... give the midwest some much-needed love.
 
Great thread. anyone have any thoughts on loyola or cleveland clinic? loyola seemed to have a great atmosphere and the pd was great. the residents were very nice, but their fellowship list was only average. is cleveland clinic considered a univ program? freida lists it as "other". would this hurt for fellowships?
 
Bump this ol' dirty thread....


Any one have any thoughts on MCW? How 'bout the Chairman that's currently up there now?
 
I see a couple programs have been left out. Probably because they are not "premier" programs, but are very solid in any case. They are University of Louisville and University of Missoui-Columbia (AKA MU). The former is a large program with 5 or so hospitals in the system (including a VA med center), and the later a smaller system with 3 hospitals (one of which is a VA center). I am in Med-Peds residency in Louisville, and went to school at MU.
 
What about other Midwest programs. Nebraska, Kansas or Arkansas?
 
"The focus of this thread was to compare the other Midwest programs (U Wisconsin, U Minnesota, MCW, CWRU, U Iowa, Indiana U, Rush, Loyola, UIC). Let us hear the voices of residents and students who are from these institutions."

Well said. Does anyone else have anything to offer? There's gotta be more people out there with interest in the Midwest or input on these programs. What kind of financial troubles did Minnesota have? I wasn't aware of this.


Just FYI - there is a great review of the U Minnesota program on this thread offered by Adcadet....

http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=341124

didn't read the whole thing, but it appears to be pretty thorough to me.
 
Well, here's my opinion of a few programs. I interviewed last year at several programs in the Mid-West, but ultimately went to a program in the West, so take this for what it's worth- I only comment on programs where I interviewed.

Oh, one thing. To avoid confusion, how about in this thread referring to U of Minn and U of Mich rather than just U of M, which is anyone's guess as to which program is being referred to :)

U of Mich: Obviously well known program, but despite having a very pleasant interview day, I had the definite feeling that I would be a small, unimportant cog in a big machine, and residents were a disposable commodity.

U of Minn: See adcadet's post-- I agreed, really liked the program, but I dont' know what changes might have been wrought by the new PD and the flux the program seems to be in.

U of Wisconsin: I had heard good things but was sorely disappointed when I interviewed. Despite the high regard people seemed to hold for the PD, to me he was disinterested and bored on interview day. He seemed reluctant to even talk to the applicants. Admittedly it was fairly late in the interview season, but still... Also, one of the residents at the dinner the night beforehand did nothing but complain, which did not give me a good feel for the program. The program did not fill last year, which indicates others probably felt the same way. I'm sure they filled the slot in the scramble. I was impressed with the critical care director who took a lot of time with me, and essentially gave me a second tour to show me stuff that the tour had left out but I was interested in, but I couldn't get past the PD's attitude that day... I don't know, maybe he was sick or something.

Mayo Rochester: This program is probably discussed to death. Big program, impressive facility and faculty and great support staff, in a less than desirable location. Despite protestations to the contrary it did seem fellow run. Residents may write the orders but the many layers of supervision seem to me to relieve the residents of any real responsibility. Of course there should be supervision of interns, but senior residents should have more responsibility, in my opinion. But I'm certain you'd learn a lot from the staff there, so that might make up for it.

Univ of Iowa: I think it was a solid program, but seemed to be unsure of how to address some of the issues facing it-- like balancing compliance with work hours and education. It's a problem every program faces, but most at least have a strategy to try, whether they work at first or not.

Hope that helps someone-- or at least gives applicants ideas for questions to ask.
 
The financial concerns at Fairview-University Medical Center, now renamed the University of Minnesota Medical Center - Fairview, hasn't come up in years now.

You'll find a number of midwest programs reviewed in this thread.
 
Glad this thread got started as I'm only interviewing in the midwest and san francisco.

I'm sad to hear that michigan is "malignant" although i'm not even sure exactly what that means. I absolutely LOVED it when I interviewed for med school and always thought perhaps I would do residency there. I still think that...interviewing soon and hoping I like it just as much as 4 years ago!

As for Chicago and NWU, I'm curious to see what they are like. They are much farther down on my list than Michigan, but I wouldn't mind living in Chicago and I have heard good things about both programs.

Does anyone know if interviewing at just 4 places is enough to get matched? I don't want to go to my NY interviews because I don't want to live there anymore. I thought people usualy get one of their top 2, but am weary.

I'm looking forward to seeing what other opinions people have about Uof Michigan, etc.

good luck all!!
 
can anyone compare Ohio state versus UPittsburgh? I only want to interview at one of these and i cant decide.
 
Glad this thread got started as I'm only interviewing in the midwest and san francisco.

I'm sad to hear that michigan is "malignant" although i'm not even sure exactly what that means. I absolutely LOVED it when I interviewed for med school and always thought perhaps I would do residency there. I still think that...interviewing soon and hoping I like it just as much as 4 years ago!

As for Chicago and NWU, I'm curious to see what they are like. They are much farther down on my list than Michigan, but I wouldn't mind living in Chicago and I have heard good things about both programs.

Does anyone know if interviewing at just 4 places is enough to get matched? I don't want to go to my NY interviews because I don't want to live there anymore. I thought people usualy get one of their top 2, but am weary.

I'm looking forward to seeing what other opinions people have about Uof Michigan, etc.

good luck all!!


Like KingofHerarts said, we had a long, drawn out discussion about UofMich and Wash U in an old thread. Since then, Michigan has made a lot of changes over the past 2-3 years and is much more intern friendly;) :

1. the intern cap has been reduced from 12 -> 10 -> 8 now.
2. there are no longer any "cap busters," meaning you can only take a maximum of 5 pt's per call night (in the past, lung/liver txps, acute leuks, ICU players, etc would still be admitted by interns even if they had already reached the usual 5 admits that night).
3. Call months have been reduced from ~9 months to ~7 months per yr as an intern, allowing for more elective/consult months. Senior months remain unchanged at ~3 months per yr.


In regards to NW and UofChicago, definitely check them both out. Chicago is a great city and both programs would provide excellent training. It was a tough choice between UofC and UofM for me. NW is definitely more cush from what I'm told, but I heard they've been making a lot of changes to reduce the number of private pts.

I would interview with at least 7 programs, even for IM (unless of course you're a freaking stellar applicant and are pretty much guaranteed of getting into whatever program you choose). It's just nice to see how different programs run things and opens your eyes as to what's really out there. The midwest has a TON of great programs, so keep your mind open!

Good luck!
 
The U mich program definitely seems less malignant compared to the past. The PD seemed v involved and awesome. On the whole a great program. On my interview day, most residents seemed sort of happy.

Any thoughts, esp by current residents at U Mich.

Google
 
Just to clarify:
1) I'm not sure what you mean by malignant, but my medicine attendings for the 5 months I was on service were awesome.
2) Only seniors on inpatient services go to morning report (I think)
3) We actually had a fair number of residents the day I interviewed at the dinner the night before. Obviously there is probably some variation in the numbers coming to dinners. Let's face it, can you imagine going to more than 3 dinners per interview season as a resident? I figure I'd have something better to do.
4) Depends on where you come from in terms of the concept of being a cog in a large machine. I've gotten the equivalent vibe from every place I've interviewed so far.

Just my $.02
 
Had a nice interview at the Cleveland Clinic. Impressive place. Why do applicants seem to avoid it??
 
Had a nice interview at the Cleveland Clinic. Impressive place. Why do applicants seem to avoid it??


The word on the street is that they work you pretty hard there (beware: third hand info). Also, I think there are better IM programs in the city (again third hand info). Otherwise, I also had a nice interview there, was impressed with the facilities and will be including it on my final list (where exactly I haven't figured that out).
 
anyone have ne info on MCW
 
can u be more specific about the crappiness;)
 
I'm from the midwest, but don't think I've heard of some of these... what's/where's lsu shreveport? MCW?
 
pardon my previous mispost:)

anyways any info on medical college of ohio/university of toledo???

i think this is as midwest as it gets;)
 
can anyone compare Ohio state versus UPittsburgh? I only want to interview at one of these and i cant decide.

Hopefully this advice isn't coming too late, but i recommend choosing Pitt. Dont know much about Ohio State, but Pitt is top notch academically, you will get great training, and the program is very resident-friendly. It's a challenging course, but not brutal b/c the chief residents, PD, and most attendings care about changing things that are unnecessarily difficult. Mostly resident-run, except on consult months, where obviously the fellow is going to be a bit higher up. I know a couple people who did not expect to end up here, but had to scramble into the program as prelims (prelim program here usually doesn't fill b/c it's not a cush year compared to a few other prelim programs in pittsburgh). They are very happy things ended up this way, and one of them is thinking of staying for all 3 years for IM. The new PD named earlier this academic year is great. she has been at UPMC for many years, and is universally loved by housestaff and med students.

Also Pittsburgh is a nice city. It has really grown on me and I will miss it a lot when i leave next year.
 
I think the overall impression I have of U Mich is that's it's a fantastic program which is probably more rigorous than similar programs. Even before I interview there I imagine I'll end up ranking it pretty high up. Does anyone know what it's like living in Ann Arbor though? That's the only thing which would prevent me from making it numero uno
 
pardon my previous mispost:)

anyways any info on medical college of ohio/university of toledo???

i think this is as midwest as it gets;)

Are you looking at the St Vincent's Mercy system in Toledo? well I guess it really doesn't matter since they combined that program with the other one. What info do you want?
 
hi there hernandez

im looking at medical college of ohio / university of toledo - the main uni program.

u mention the programs combined? but they still have separate freida pages. is this a recent occurence? how do the residents rotate then? is it like other uni progs like wayne et al where there is one private and one university hospital with residents spending equal time between the two?

how do u rate the pathology?

where do the residents land up? esp in terms of cards? they have 2 spots. do they take in their own? how is the faculty push?

malignancy? teaching?

any other general points from u. ru a student / resident there?
 
hi there hernandez

im looking at medical college of ohio / university of toledo - the main uni program.

how do u rate the pathology?

where do the residents land up? esp in terms of cards? they have 2 spots. do they take in their own? how is the faculty push?

malignancy? teaching?

any other general points from u. ru a student / resident there?

For clarification, I rotated through St V's Mercy. And it appeared that they combined the Osteopathic and allopathic programs to give them a dually accredited program, and they were just starting to have some of the UoT people to rotate through St V's. so they'd probably still have two separate pages since they still are part of the osteopathic match. I am a 4th year who rotated through a month of general teaching svc.

I can not say much in the way of fellowship placement, or how the rotations are run outside of St V's. but I can tell you that overall, it's a decent program. Pathology is great, in fact, if I would ever get home to finish up my research, I have a case report that could be published from my month there. one of the interns I was with, was actually a FMG who had already graduated a medicine program in Scotland and had practiced on his own for a few years, was always raving about how great the pathology was there.

They have separate morning reports, but at St V's, they tended to be good. They'd have a different attending every morning and a different svc would give a case presentation and the attending would lead through the differential dx and what you should do. And on Friday's they have cardio/pulm x-ray conf done by Dr V Mahajan which were very good. The main thing I disliked about the program were their didactics. They had both groups go to either the St V's or other campus on Wens for a combined didactics which were from 0900 to 1200. 3 hours once a week is horrible if ya ask me, the lecture's quality like anywhere depended on the presenter. All the presenters were attendings, but not all of them were good. They do not have a Harrison's reading club as far as I know, nor did I see any journal clubs.

St V's has a split short call/long call system with a night intern which works nicely. They have admission caps and service caps which was very nice. And for the most part the load was very manageable and almost light while I was there, but we had very high intensity pts and we weren't bogged down with Class I pneumonias or chronic back pain or other fluff pts while I was there. We frequently had SDH, a cerebellar stroke, newly diagnosed multiple myeloma, and quite a few very sick pts.

I didn't meet all the Uni T residents, but the ones I did were friendly. But something to note is it is a heavily FMG program. While not a bad thing, can be a turn off for native trained students. And frankly, yes it is horrible as a student to sit in a room and listen to a FMG do an H&P on a almost deaf white guy when they can't understand each other. :laugh: But this is not a slight against FMGs or their competence, the residents there were all great and good at what they do.

The attendings I worked with were all excellent, Dr K Mahajan gave daily 20-30 minute lectures that were excellent and he genuinely loved to teach and I learned a lot from him. V Mahajan seemed to be the same way, as were the several others I met. but again, I was at St V's, not the other campus.

I believe they are going to be going through some transitional growing pains due to the changes, but they should be very short lived since both programs were already established. And I would not call this program malignant by any means
 
The U mich program definitely seems less malignant compared to the past. The PD seemed v involved and awesome. On the whole a great program. On my interview day, most residents seemed sort of happy.

However I did notice only 15 residents attended the morning report on our interview day. And they have like 165 residents total over 3 years. (True some of them would be at VA or out-pt clinic... but still..) I wonder what happened to the remaing 150 residents? over worked? Not interested? or told by the program to not come if they can't stay positive? Attendance at the dinner was also less than optimal.


For the most part only seniors go to morning report -- although interns are welcomed if they have the time. There are 16 senior residents on service at any one time at the University and another 4 at the VA. The 4 night floats are home sleeping. The SMRs assigned as STAR in the ED are probably not going to make it. The consult residents are likely seeing consults or rounding. Subtract off the post-call, those who have the day off, med-peds either at the children's (MOTT) hospital or at the community hospital they also go to, and subtract a few more who are on research or vacation months; and you are left with 8 to 20 senior residents at morning report.

The program is not malignant. They give us fresh salt water to wash the whip marks daily:smuggrin: Seriously though, I am happy with my choice in coming to the University of Michigan.

All things being equal, use your gut when deciding about a program. If something just feels off to you, listen you yourself. In the end you are the person you are trying to satisfy.

Good luck.
 
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