Canadians CANNOT specialize in the States???

[spiritedaway]

Is it true that if you are an international student (for example a Canadian, like me) it is more difficult (next to impossible) to secure a spot in a specialization residency? (ex. ortho or pedo, the two that I really want to pursue) Right now, I am a canadian citizen but I really want to attend dental school in the US and eventually apply to residencies in the US and practice in the US. Will my dental specialty dream be shattered?

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[grtuck]

I don't know how hard it is, but there are a couple of Canadians in my dental class.

 

[LestatZinnie]

Is it true that if you are an international student (for example a Canadian, like me) it is more difficult (next to impossible) to secure a spot in a specialization residency? (ex. ortho or pedo, the two that I really want to pursue) Right now, I am a canadian citizen but I really want to attend dental school in the US and eventually apply to residencies in the US and practice in the US. Will my dental specialty dream be shattered?

i wouldn't count on the USA for your future endeavors. I wanted to do an externship in UCSF and now they're not even accepting students from outside US due to 9/11 and Patriot Act. Also, you can't own a practice in the US unless you hold greencard- I assume you know that right. attending a canadian school also saves you big bucks.

 

[Yah-E]

I believe that you're qualified to apply and participate in an UCSF externship as long as you are a US permenant resident ("green card" holder).

 

[ItsGavinC]

Is it true that if you are an international student (for example a Canadian, like me) it is more difficult (next to impossible) to secure a spot in a specialization residency? (ex. ortho or pedo, the two that I really want to pursue) Right now, I am a canadian citizen but I really want to attend dental school in the US and eventually apply to residencies in the US and practice in the US. Will my dental specialty dream be shattered?

Not impossible, but it may be more difficult. It seems like LOTS of prosth. residents are foreign graduates.

 

[DrRob]

Canadians can specialize in the US - there were 2 Canadians in the ortho program at marquette that graduated in 2003. There is also an Ortho Program in Rochester (eastman) that pays a stipend of around 40K and will allow Canadians on TN work visas.

 

[texas_dds]

houston has a canadian in ortho
san antonio has a canadian in endo

you will probably pay international tuition however (unless you have a green card)

BUT, to practice here afterwards, you need a green card

 

[YAH-OO!]

houston has a canadian in ortho
san antonio has a canadian in endo

you will probably pay international tuition however (unless you have a green card)

BUT, to practice here afterwards, you need a green card

NO YOU DON'T - YOU NEED A STATE LICENSCE AND TN OR H1B VISA - TO OWN A PRACTICE YOU NEED A GREEN CARD

 

[texas_dds]

my bad - you are right
but please turn off your caps lock

 

[EHA DDS]

I know of 2 Canadians who are specializing in the US. One went to Howard and is now doing Pedodontics at Albert Einstein and a family friend who went to Case Western and did a GPR and now Ortho at Mount Sinai in NYC. So it is possible.

 

[Dr.BadVibes]

Just check the yellow pages in Toronto and you'll find that most specialists were trained down south....

 

[watanka]

hmm..
if you are applying for OS,
most 4 year program you can apply to
but 6 year programs NOW need Permanent residency or Citizenship due to new immigration law..
Some 6 yr programs did take Canadian but starting this year they stop
so please keep this in mind and please tell your friends who are applying to US 6yr OMS residency..so they won't go through the things I am going through....

 

[Jediwendell]

GPR guy from San Antonio was from Canada and matched OMS at Michigan last year. About nine of the GPR guys were from Canada, too.

 

[lnn2]

Will my dental specialty dream be shattered?

Yup, most dreams are shattered and/or laughed at

I would go for Ortho, unless you love kids, more than u should

Let us known whenever you've made up your mind though, Pharmacy, Pre-med, and Dental. Pick one, so that you wouldn't fail all of them at the same time

 

[LSR1979]

Regarding this whole post - and I don't want to offend anybody - BUT, I hope that most specialty programs and dental schools don't accept many, if any, international students. There is already a shortage of dentists in many areas and that shortage is increasing quickly. So if America trains a bunch of foreign dentists and then they go running off to their homeland, then our shortage situation has not been helped at all. This is especially true in Canada. You have your own dental schools - attend them. Its also amazing that Canadians sit and brag about how great their healthcare system is but all of them want to train in the U.S. Sorry I don't mean to sound like a bigot, but I didn't apply to nor would I have attended a dental school elsewhere. Some students I can understand if they don't have dental schools in their country, but Canada is another situation. Stay north.

 

[dort-ort]

Regarding this whole post - and I don't want to offend anybody - BUT, I hope that most specialty programs and dental schools don't accept many, if any, international students. There is already a shortage of dentists in many areas and that shortage is increasing quickly. So if America trains a bunch of foreign dentists and then they go running off to their homeland, then our shortage situation has not been helped at all. This is especially true in Canada. You have your own dental schools - attend them. Its also amazing that Canadians sit and brag about how great their healthcare system is but all of them want to train in the U.S. Sorry I don't mean to sound like a bigot, but I didn't apply to nor would I have attended a dental school elsewhere. Some students I can understand if they don't have dental schools in their country, but Canada is another situation. Stay north.

Well put and I echo your sentiments. I have seen many canadian students enter a program in the US and decide they want to stay solely because of economic benefits. Of course they always say (to admissions committe or chair of program) they will be going back to their country of origin once they are done. However, somehow they wiggle their way into a green card (by way of marriage or another) and end up staying here. One may say that this helps the PERCIEVED shortage of dentist. But in my view this takes away spots in programs for legitimate U.S. candidates. In the wider scope of things, I think Canadians are a bunch of woosies. Being that they are neighbors to the north and are in the same hemisphere as us, why do they never support the world views of the United States. What a bunch of crock they are. I feel justified that the patriot act makes it harder for them to enter into U.S. schools because of their lack of backbone to support anything that the US government does. So I agree with what LSR1979 says to these canadians - Stay North, period.

 

[ip]

Canadians can ABSOLUTELY specialize in the US. The programs that have restricted foreign applications do not include Canada as foreign.

US Graduate=Canadian Graduate=Canadian citizen who trained in the US

The only reason to need a green card is to own your own practice.

 

[dort-ort]

Canadians can ABSOLUTELY specialize in the US. The programs that have restricted foreign applications do not include Canada as foreign.

US Graduate=Canadian Graduate=Canadian citizen who trained in the US

The only reason to need a green card is to own your own practice.

Of course they can, never said they can't. And regarding the green card -- no one is arguing the reason why they need it. Yes they need it to practice dentistry in the U.S., for that matter to work in any profession in the U.S. Just that foriegn candidates end up trying to stay in the U.S. to work here after completing their programs cause they find out it is more financially rewarding. Of course they don't say this at the entrance interviews for dental school or specialty programs. Especially specialty programs. (i know from personal experience). And thats a crock of you know what.

 

[watanka]

Well put and I echo your sentiments. I have seen many canadian students enter a program in the US and decide they want to stay solely because of economic benefits. Of course they always say (to admissions committe or chair of program) they will be going back to their country of origin once they are done. However, somehow they wiggle their way into a green card (by way of marriage or another) and end up staying here. One may say that this helps the PERCIEVED shortage of dentist. But in my view this takes away spots in programs for legitimate U.S. candidates. In the wider scope of things, I think Canadians are a bunch of woosies. Being that they are neighbors to the north and are in the same hemisphere as us, why do they never support the world views of the United States. What a bunch of crock they are. I feel justified that the patriot act makes it harder for them to enter into U.S. schools because of their lack of backbone to support anything that the US government does. So I agree with what LSR1979 says to these canadians - Stay North, period.

Guys!
the thread began as a Canadian student trying to help out a fellow Canadian student. There is no reason for you to attack my country or my country men...

I thought my fellow dental students are much more mature than this.
Wow I am very surprised and very disappointed.

 

[toofache32]

There are 2 canadians in my OMFS program, but the paperwork is a big headache, they say.

But you can do it, eh?

 

[north2southOMFS]

eh, I saw a ton of candadians in OMFS programs I interviewed at last year all over the country eh, and eh, the majority of them seem to be in dat der place of detroit eh. Maybe cause its so close to toronto eh?

Ok ok, enough jokes, yes you can come here and do any specialty you'd like, but it will be harder for you to get in and you still have liscencing issues here when your finished.

I guess the question is do you want to stay here or go back when your done.

Then there will be no problems eh?

 

[BSSO]

Well put and I echo your sentiments. I have seen many canadian students enter a program in the US and decide they want to stay solely because of economic benefits. Of course they always say (to admissions committe or chair of program) they will be going back to their country of origin once they are done. However, somehow they wiggle their way into a green card (by way of marriage or another) and end up staying here. One may say that this helps the PERCIEVED shortage of dentist. But in my view this takes away spots in programs for legitimate U.S. candidates. In the wider scope of things, I think Canadians are a bunch of woosies. Being that they are neighbors to the north and are in the same hemisphere as us, why do they never support the world views of the United States. What a bunch of crock they are. I feel justified that the patriot act makes it harder for them to enter into U.S. schools because of their lack of backbone to support anything that the US government does. So I agree with what LSR1979 says to these canadians - Stay North, period.

What you don't understand about Canadian dental schools is that there is probably 1:100 the positions for dental school as the states, and 1:1000 the number of specialty positions. It is extremly difficult to get into a Canadian dental school and next to impossible to get into a speciality, simply because of the lack of numbers. The reason there is such a sortage of spots is because the goverment funds these positions and the education system is not privatized such as plenty of the professional schools in the states. You should keep this in mind before bashing people that want to get an education outside of their own countries.

 

[ip]

Of course they can, never said they can't. And regarding the green card -- no one is arguing the reason why they need it. Yes they need it to practice dentistry in the U.S., for that matter to work in any profession in the U.S. Just that foriegn candidates end up trying to stay in the U.S. to work here after completing their programs cause they find out it is more financially rewarding. Of course they don't say this at the entrance interviews for dental school or specialty programs. Especially specialty programs. (i know from personal experience). And thats a crock of you know what.

No, actually Canadians do NOT need a green card to practice in the US. All that's needed is a TN visa which can be obtained in around 5 minutes at the border.

As for what is said at the interview, I've always been upfront that I am staying in the US and I've been accepted to every school I've interviewed at. They don't care, they just ask for conversational purposes.

Licensing isn't even a problem at all. All Canadians have to do is pass the board exam, exactly like grads of US schools.

Sorry to burst your bubble... we're coming down!

 

[LSR1979]

Its a sad day when our professional schools will accept a foreign student (in order to meet a quota or to "diversify") in place of a US citizen. This is especially true of state funded institutions where that citizen and/or their parents have been paying taxes their whole life to fund its operations. Just shows you what a buch of garbage the liberal mindset is. At my school, the minority students are literally handed scholarships while the non-minority students can't even get applications.

 

[dort-ort]

No, actually Canadians do NOT need a green card to practice in the US. All that's needed is a TN visa which can be obtained in around 5 minutes at the border.

As for what is said at the interview, I've always been upfront that I am staying in the US and I've been accepted to every school I've interviewed at. They don't care, they just ask for conversational purposes.

Licensing isn't even a problem at all. All Canadians have to do is pass the board exam, exactly like grads of US schools.

Sorry to burst your bubble... we're coming down!

No, Actually Foriegners/Immigrants Do need a green card to practice in the U.S. What you are referring to is not equivalent to a green card at all. Yes you can get a temporary working visa -- the U.S. govt. allows this so that foriegners can gain work experience. This visa is only temporary (3 yrs.or less) then you must get the heck out because at that point you're an illegal alien otherwise you'll be kicked out of the U.S.

Its fine and dandy that you say you are going to stay at the outfront. Why don't you tell your 100's of canadian friends to do the same when they apply.

By the way there's no bubble to burst here. I am merely expressing my personal view on this subject. This forum allows for differences in viewpoint and i am voicing mine. Do not fret and do not get angry. Sometimes the truth hurts.

 

[lnn2]

Is it true that if you are an international student (for example a Canadian, like me) it is more difficult (next to impossible) to secure a spot in a specialization residency? (ex. ortho or pedo, the two that I really want to pursue) Right now, I am a canadian citizen but I really want to attend dental school in the US and eventually apply to residencies in the US and practice in the US. Will my dental specialty dream be shattered?

Wow, you guys getting all worked up for nothing The OP is only a kid. She's still in high school Still not sure what she wants Pharmacy/Premed/Dental.
Canadian women

 

[Dr.BadVibes]

Well, I dont know which state schools you are talking about where Canadians are "stealing" spots from students whose parents pay taxes their whole lives to the state...its pretty damn hard for a Canadian to get into a US state school primarily based on the reasons you explained

But as far as saying Canadians are stealing spots from other well-qualified US students, I disagree.

Lets take the two schools which probably have the most Canadians....NYU and BU. Everyone knows these schools are the most expensive schools in the US, and thus will have a hard time attracting US students with high statistics. Most likely, the US students who are gonna attend BU will be people with lower statistics. However, since there is not enough seats in Canada, students up north with a 3.7 get rejected and have to come down south and apply to these schools because they are private and no show no US student preference. So the adcom will get a US student with a 3.1 GPA and a Canadian student with a 3.7 GPA who is forced to apply to the private school.

Remember, these are private schools and not bound to any state quota requirement. Since these are private schools, of course they want to attract the best students because that will reflect in their average GPA entrances and will make them look better. So who are they gonna choose? The US 3.1 or the Canadian 3.7?

The point Im making? If a US student and a Canadian student have the exact same statistics, then yes, the US student will win hands down. However, if the Canadian is more qualified, why wouldnt the PRIVATE school accept the more qualified student which makes their school look better??

 

[LeFort]

I don't understand why this debate is going on.

Forget the politics.
Canada is the USA's best friend, not the UK or any other country. Just look at the map.

Canada is by far the United States' largest trading partner, with more than $1.4 billion in trade per day.

Canada supplies 16.5 per cent of all US imports of goods and services, while Canada bought 19 per cent of all American goods and services. That's a lot.

Canada is the leading export market for 35 of 50 U.S. States like New York and Michigan, so lots of jobs in the US depend on Canada.

Also, Canada has a lot of oil, and it's ready to flow to the US.

Finally, Canada and the US signed an agreement, it's called NAFTA and it vowed to encourage free circulation of goods AND persons in North America.
Under this agreement, qualified Canadian professionnals can obtain a TN visa to work for one year in the US, and it's renewable

The deal is reciprocal: remember that Americans too can get into Canadian programs in general. (I know med schools that train a lot of Americans... and the tuition is much cheaper in Canada...)

If Canadians get into US programs, it's because they are more qualified. (Remember that dental school is much harder to get into in Canada)

And if a program has to choose between a qualified American and a Canadian, I can bet you they will take the American.

 

[Dr.BadVibes]

Well put and I echo your sentiments. I have seen many canadian students enter a program in the US and decide they want to stay solely because of economic benefits. Of course they always say (to admissions committe or chair of program) they will be going back to their country of origin once they are done. However, somehow they wiggle their way into a green card (by way of marriage or another) and end up staying here. One may say that this helps the PERCIEVED shortage of dentist. But in my view this takes away spots in programs for legitimate U.S. candidates. In the wider scope of things, I think Canadians are a bunch of woosies. Being that they are neighbors to the north and are in the same hemisphere as us, why do they never support the world views of the United States. What a bunch of crock they are. I feel justified that the patriot act makes it harder for them to enter into U.S. schools because of their lack of backbone to support anything that the US government does. So I agree with what LSR1979 says to these canadians - Stay North, period.

I dont know if you have noticed, but Canada is a soverign nation with a completely different political ideology than the US. Sure we share many similiraties in other aspects, but historically when it comes to domestic and foreign policy, we are night and day. Why is that a problem?

And by the way, why do you say we dont always support the world views of the US? If you havent realized, Canada has one of the largest contigents in Afghanistan, a war in which we always supported the US.

 

[ip]

Its a sad day when our professional schools will accept a foreign student (in order to meet a quota or to "diversify") in place of a US citizen. This is especially true of state funded institutions where that citizen and/or their parents have been paying taxes their whole life to fund its operations. Just shows you what a buch of garbage the liberal mindset is. At my school, the minority students are literally handed scholarships while the non-minority students can't even get applications.

Oh, you're a conservative. And here I was wondering why facts don't play a role in forming your opinions. That explains that.

FYI, private schools take students based on qualifications. If an American doesn't qualify but a foreigner does, so be it. What you are looking for is for someone to get in to a school based on where they come from, as opposed to how good they are. You are what you preach against.

dort: I am a Canadian and I have practiced in the US and I do not have a green card. Once again, a green card is NOT required for a Canadian to practice. It IS required if you want to own a practice. A Canadian can work with a TN visa that needs to be renewed each year but has no limit. My wife has been on this for the past 7 years. A H1B can be had for 3 years plus renewable for another 3 years. No one in their right mind will want to stay on a TN forever and will eventually get a green card but a Canadian can easily practice for 10-15 years WITHOUT a green card.

But what you don't understand is that schools do not care whether students stay or go. If at all, what I've found is that they want us to stay. They feel that if the US is giving the education, the US should benefit from it. Sorry bud, it's the truth.

No anger here, just frustration at a couple folks blocking their ears and repeating a mantra that they want to believe.

 

[lnn2]

I love to see a thread turning into something totally different than when it first started
People need to stop being a tight @ss and play nice to each other

PS. I am a US citizen. If any of you Canadian ladies out there needs help w/ the Green card. I'll be happy to lend more than a hand I'm not asking much, just single, not too shabby looking and no excess baggage

 

[crimson]

I am proud to be studying with the canadians at my US school. It's great that both public and private schools judge students based on their merit not nationality.
BUT I am frustrated with the fact that Canadian educational institutions in no way reciprocate such openness. For eg., even at my state funded dental school we have Canadians, whereas no provincial dental school in canada that I know of will even interview a foreign applicant including Americans. That's quite uncool coz I for one would love to go to a place like UBC which has perhaps the most spectacular campus in North America!

 

[Woodsy]

ok first the girl who started this thread isn't even in dental school yet. Already she is trying to run before she learns how to walk. This analogy can be carried over and metaphorically she's still a cripple or a baby who is not yet ready to walk or still in rehab, yet you want to be a world class sprinter??!!?? OMG!!!!. I am a Canadian who is in a REAL Canadian school for dentistry, not those Canadians who settle for some joke American school coz they can't get into a good school in the US or Canada. I say this, go through dental school first before you choose whether it is you want to specialize and deal with it when it comes.

People bashing on Canada? I was one of the ones who got into a REAL Canadian school; The best in Canada, not some bs school like Dalhouise... we have no americans in our class. Yet I was accepted and given interviews by practically every dental school i applied to in the US. Don't tell me that I am not good enough for the US. Fact is, after going through 4 years in undergrad hell and about to go through 4 years in dental school I don't think I want to specialize. So to the girl who is so worried about it all, go through it first before you start worrying about something that might not even happen.

I apologize to you all for my straight forwardness.

 

[DrRob]

ok first the girl who started this thread isn't even in dental school yet. Already she is trying to run before she learns how to walk. This analogy can be carried over and metaphorically she's still a cripple or a baby who is not yet ready to walk or still in rehab, yet you want to be a world class sprinter??!!?? OMG!!!!. I am a Canadian who is in a REAL Canadian school for dentistry, not those Canadians who settle for some joke American school coz they can't get into a good school in the US or Canada. I say this, go through dental school first before you choose whether it is you want to specialize and deal with it when it comes.

People bashing on Canada? I was one of the ones who got into a REAL Canadian school; The best in Canada, not some bs school like Dalhouise... we have no americans in our class. Yet I was accepted and given interviews by practically every dental school i applied to in the US. Don't tell me that I am not good enough for the US. Fact is, after going through 4 years in undergrad hell and about to go through 4 years in dental school I don't think I want to specialize. So to the girl who is so worried about it all, go through it first before you start worrying about something that might not even happen.

I apologize to you all for my straight forwardness.

Hate to break it to but U of T is not all its cracked up to be. My friend graduated from U of T after doing his undergrad at what you would consider a joke of an american School Lake Superior State University in Soo Michigan. He hated U of T. The faculty and his competitive classmates. I am one of those you refer to who could not get into a real canadian school with an 86% ave from Honors Physiology at UWO - I was on the waiting list so I went to Marquette and graduated 14 of 75. Milwaukee was awesome and my best friends are from my dental school class. I passed the Canadian NDBE which is a joke compared to becoming licensed in wisconsin (2 written exams plus a clinical exam). I would get off your soapbox until you finish your first year of dental school - getting accepted is one thing; graduating is another.

 

[Woodsy]

yeah well my friend went to U of T, graduated and is now doing ortho residency in the US. Boston I think, as well as many other of my dental fraternity alumni brothers who have been accepted at all the residencies they wanted. What can you say about that Dr. Rob???

In terms of specializing I don't even want to specialize and I can bet you that I can and will graduate. Haven't you heard of six-o and go? hmm? Guess not because you didn't go to U of T. You and I are the same, both biased to our own schools. But I do understand from your perspective, you have to protect the integrity of your school and your education to verify that it wasn't a joke which it probably was not but you felt insecure enough about it to bash me for bashing the US schools.

The difference between me and those pre dents is that I am in dental school. You can fail a course and not get kicked out. Just pass and go. They have a pretty good system here in Canada to make sure you graduate. Guess you didn't know that either coz you went to the US.

 

[DrRob]

yeah well my friend went to U of T, graduated and is now doing ortho residency in the US. Boston I think, as well as many other of my dental fraternity alumni brothers who have been accepted at all the residencies they wanted. What can you say about that Dr. Rob???

In terms of specializing I don't even want to specialize and I can bet you that I can and will graduate. Haven't you heard of six-o and go? hmm? Guess not because you didn't go to U of T. You and I are the same, both biased to our own schools. But I do understand from your perspective, you have to protect the integrity of your school and your education to verify that it wasn't a joke which it probably was not but you felt insecure enough about it to bash me for bashing the US schools.

The difference between me and those pre dents is that I am in dental school. You can fail a course and not get kicked out. Just pass and go. They have a pretty good system here in Canada to make sure you graduate. Guess you didn't know that either coz you went to the US.

No I was not insecure - Its ironic that you judge the girl for asking a question about specializing before dental school - while yourself bashing a US dental education without having gone through 1 semester of dental education yourself. The whole analogy you give of trying to run before you walk - maybe you should follow it.

I am not biased toward Marquette - I much would have rather gone to Western only for the fact of cheaper tuition with summers off. And as far as residencies go - everyone in my class who applied to OS, ORTHO, and PROS matched.

 

[Woodsy]

I've been through half but from what my peers have told me in the upper years and from what I am experiencing right now, it's not that difficult. Doesn't get difficult for a while. The difference is, I am walking atm not running. I am not the one who is all pent up and worried about specializing am I? NO. I am just trying to get through dental school. I am dealing with it as it comes. Unlike that other girl. Get your facts straight.

#2, ok so I bashed the American schools. That was for bashing Canadians and how they would rather take an American. My point is that I've been able to get into the American school system but chose not to because I got into a Canadian one. Meaning that even if you let me in the best school in America I would not even want to go and would rather choose a Canadian one, but it does not mean that I am not qualified to be at an American school. You should really read my posts carefully before you jump to your conclusions and try to reword what it is that i say and then changing the whole my messages.

 

[north2southOMFS]

Is it true that if you are an international student (for example a Canadian, like me) it is more difficult (next to impossible) to secure a spot in a specialization residency?

Ok buddy who just got into dental school and has no idea what the future holds. The gal who started this thread seems to be thinking things through a little better than you.

What she wants to know is will it be easier should she decide to specialize, by going to an american or canadian dental school?

Here is my take on the subject:

Yes it will be easier to specialize by going to an american dental school.

Why...because there simply are more residency training programs available in the united states than there are in canada. Period. It has nothing to do with who has the better dental school, if it is accredited, it's as good as the rest, you learn your specialty in your residency, not your dental school.

The reason it is easier to get into an american residency after coming out of an american school is that most state sponsored hospitals or schools where the residencies are will favor the person who has gotten their education(doctorate) in the US, because they have paid taxes and so on and are familiar with the dental school you are coming from.


So I believe our gal in question is very smart in asking a question like that. Don't listen to close minded fools like you canadian counterpart above, he really knows absolutely nothing but now feels a little cooler like we all did once we started dental school, and he feels the need to show off a bit.

Good luck with your future.

 

[LestatZinnie]

I've been through half but from what my peers have told me in the upper years and from what I am experiencing right now, it's not that difficult. Doesn't get difficult for a while. The difference is, I am walking atm not running. I am not the one who is all pent up and worried about specializing am I? NO. I am just trying to get through dental school. I am dealing with it as it comes. Unlike that other girl. Get your facts straight.

#2, ok so I bashed the American schools. That was for bashing Canadians and how they would rather take an American. My point is that I've been able to get into the American school system but chose not to because I got into a Canadian one. Meaning that even if you let me in the best school in America I would not even want to go and would rather choose a Canadian one, but it does not mean that I am not qualified to be at an American school. You should really read my posts carefully before you jump to your conclusions and try to reword what it is that i say and then changing the whole my messages.

Woodsy...you really need to get off your high horse. no wonder UT students have such a bad reputation as being arrogant egomaniacs. DrRob is already a practicing dentist (in canada, no less) and you're just a DI. Have some respect- you have much more to learn from him than vise versa.

 

[busupshot83]

Woodsy...you really need to get off your high horse. no wonder UT students have such a bad reputation as being arrogant egomaniacs. DrRob is already a practicing dentist (in canada, no less) and you're just a DI. Have some respect- you have much more to learn from him than vise versa.

 

[Woodsy]

blah blah blah..cry me a river. Don't ask me about my future. future is this... if i can get through the 4 years meaning i don't break my arm or die, i will already have a practice waiting for me to open up. I do know what the future holds for the most part. There is money saved up for the opening of my clinic four years from now. My uncle is a dentist,he's an oral surgeon. A very good one too, not to mention other cousins and such who are in specialties. I already have practices waiting for me just to finish. With regards to academics, i don't think there will be a problem. So how's that for thinking ahead? I am not only planning for the future, I am BUILDING for the future. They can think, I DO. I got into the profession because I enjoy it and I think it is for me. But I won't ever starve without it. I could easily just graduate and retire. We planned that they need referals so it would be more feasible to have me as the general guy to refer my patients to them if need be. Hence i don't plan to specialize.

As for learning from Dr. Rob, i laugh again, why do i need to learn from him when i have people who have practiced the profession much longer than he has not to mention have graduated from better schools than he has and are currently more successful than he is? He is not the be all and end all. Nor am I. But like all of us, I am entitled to an opinion and I shall stick with it. Stop sucking up to Dr. Rob just because I speak the truth and it is hard to swallow.

In terms of U of T students being arrogant egomaniacs...well, we wouldn't be if we didn't know we were better or at least shown enough data that we are. All the CDA and ODA stuff looks at U of T as a standard. Like my dean would say "Western has their interviews after people in U of T got accepted because they know that they can only get students who got rejected by U of T. No one in the right mind would go to Western." LestatZinnie, you go to McGill, so I will give you some credit. But McGill is still No U of T. You can say what you want about how i'm being biased, ignorant or unfair, but U of T would not be considered the best dental school in Canada, and one of the good ones in North America, if it wasn't valid.

You can knock all my character and personality qualities all you want. But fact is fact and you cannot diss my academic ability nor can you even criticize my potential because that is just the way it is.

Believe me if given the opportunity, most Canadians would not choose to go to the US to attend schools, wealthy or not and if from Ontario, they would NOT refuse U of T. U of T refuses them, not the other way around. Unless may be they get into Harvard...I say Harvard because I know that even at Columbia I have a few of my class mates who rejected Columbia to come here and many others of my senior peers.

No one in the World would refuse Harvard. At least I haven't heard of...

 

[north2southOMFS]

No one in the World would refuse Harvard. At least I haven't heard of...

I love it, that just shows your young ignorance.

Plenty of us inferior people down her in the states refuse harvard all of the time. It has a good name, maybe like your U of T, but the performance isn't there. You spend your time researching and writing papers all day long and that time eats into your clinical experience.

You see we have enough schools down here that you can choose which type of education you'd like. If you want a very didactic type of education, go to an East coast or west coast school, if you want a ton of clinical work, go to the midwest.

And you know, it's not very hard to say your the best school in the country when your only competing with like 4 or 5 dental schools in all of canada.

Someday you will figure out what all that means, and you'll find that good schools can produce bad dentists and bad schools produce very good dentists.

And then you'll really be surprised to know that the best and most successful dentists in your class will be the ones who finished in the middle as far as grades, because your patients really have no idea what their amalgam looks like, or what your grades in biochem were, but they know that their dentist treats them nice, talks to them, and takes care of them without any attitude. And that is why they will always be more successful than someone with your attitude.

 

[the big wand]

Really? UofT is the best school??? In which aspects? The good ones, or the bad ones??? Their stats are even lower than my class. My school uses PBL, so we don't always follow UofT as a standard. Let's see if UofT uses PBL in the future..... I think Canadian dental schools are all good but hard to get in. It's not that they don't accept Americans, but that there are more qualified students from Canada, I think. Don't quote me on this one.

No one in the World would refuse Harvard. At least I haven't heard of...

I'll refuse Harvard. If I'm a patient, I don't care where my dentist graduated from. All I care is his competency in solving my concerns in a professional manner. How many patients out there actually ask their dentists where they got their degrees? Almost zero, until they see the certificate hanging on the wall during their boring waiting time.

 

[Woodsy]

o..k if that is what you want to believe..... all sizzle no substance..that's why the school still exists and still in high demand....ok there buddy...the performance is there, there is something called a standard. Every school has to have a certain standard in Canada at least. May be that's why the schools in the US require such difficult boards and licensing because they don't have enough confidence in the dental schools so they wanna make sure all dental students who come out are good enough to practice....may be that's also why DAT scores and standardized test scores are so highly regarded.....because they know disparities exist....

In canada, the DAT doesn't account for much, and Dr. Rob said the boards were easier, may be they just have more confidence in their schools to provide top notch education. Ever think of that? Guess not.

 

[DrRob]

o..k if that is what you want to believe..... all sizzle no substance..that's why the school still exists and still in high demand....ok there buddy...the performance is there, there is something called a standard. Every school has to have a certain standard in Canada at least. May be that's why the schools in the US require such difficult boards and licensing because they don't have enough confidence in the dental schools so they wanna make sure all dental students who come out are good enough to practice....may be that's also why DAT scores and standardized test scores are so highly regarded.....because they know disparities exist....

In canada, the DAT doesn't account for much, and Dr. Rob said the boards were easier, may be they just have more confidence in their schools to provide top notch education. Ever think of that? Guess not.

Every School in the US has to undergo accredidation by the ADA. ADA approved schools are considered equivilant to Canadian Dental schools thats why we can take the same board exam as you.

Just a little side note - my partner went to Detroit and transferred to Mcgill after first year. Although, he loved Mcgill (and he is an awesome dentist) he found detroit more hands on right from year one.

By the way good luck on your first set of midterms - my friend who graduated in 2001 remembers them well

 

[EHA DDS]

Woodsy is an arrogant motherfu**er and should learn to be less rude.

HOWEVER no matter how much the Candians are hissing at his comments, he is right: if you got into UofT you'd go there in a second. I admit it for myself for sure.

BUT, Woodsy, UofT's facilities are a pile of dog ****. I spoke to a girl who was down here last weekend and she said UofT sucks in terms of facilities. And yeah, UofT students are SOCIAL ******S...thanks G-d I went to Canada's #1 school : McGill!!!!!

 

[DrRob]

Woodsy is an arrogant motherfu**er and should learn to be less rude.

HOWEVER no matter how much the Candians are hissing at his comments, he is right: if you got into UofT you'd go there in a second. I admit it for myself for sure.

BUT, Woodsy, UofT's facilities are a pile of dog ****. I spoke to a girl who was down here last weekend and she said UofT sucks in terms of facilities. And yeah, UofT students are SOCIAL ******S...thanks G-d I went to Canada's #1 school : McGill!!!!!

Of course I would have went to U of T if I had been acceppted - just for the fact its cheaper; but If I had been given a choice I would have went to UWO because I was familiar with London and the school. My point is that Ontario Dental schools turn away a lot of qualified applicants. I think I had a 3.97 on the 4.3 scale and wasn't even waitlisted in 1998 - it all depends on the applicant pool for the year. Today I hear a lot of low 80's students are accepted at western - so its just the luck of the draw. As far as Mcgill goes - I wish I would have applied there; my partner loved living in Montreal and he got a good education ( Class of 87!).

 

[LestatZinnie]

Of course I would have went to U of T if I had been acceppted - just for the fact its cheaper; but If I had been given a choice I would have went to UWO because I was familiar with London and the school. My point is that Ontario Dental schools turn away a lot of qualified applicants. I think I had a 3.97 on the 4.3 scale and wasn't even waitlisted in 1998 - it all depends on the applicant pool for the year. Today I hear a lot of low 80's students are accepted at western - so its just the luck of the draw. As far as Mcgill goes - I wish I would have applied there; my partner loved living in Montreal and he got a good education ( Class of 87!).

financially i think mcgill is the cheapest dental or even med school in canada. there are many med students in my medent class who were accepted in UT but came to mcgill, partly because of $$, and partly because mcgill has a bigger reputation than UT in the states.

 

[EHA DDS]

The cheapest school in Canada is Universite de Montreal. I think Quebecers pay 3K for med/dent and out of province pay 5K. And on their apps, you can apply to BOTH med and dent.

 

[LestatZinnie]

The cheapest school in Canada is Universite de Montreal. I think Quebecers pay 3K for med/dent and out of province pay 5K. And on their apps, you can apply to BOTH med and dent.

unfortunately it's a french school so it's not an option for most people.