Match stats

[siimpleton]

I was wondering the typical question for those who matched (and didn't) USMLE scores, school, class rank, honors in ER, MED SURG, others? Whatever you're willing to share. Also if you know of any statistics onthis anywhere. thanks!

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[NinerNiner999]

Ohh, my God. I'm feeling my carotid pulse right now and - oh, oh, there it is, placing a #12 scalpel into it and, pulsing, shooting bright red blood onto the floor, and now, oh, I feel much better...

 

[Jeff698]

We might need a ruling here, but I'd have to say this counts are remarkable restraint.

Take care,
Jeff

 

[typeB-md]

I was wondering the typical question for those who matched (and didn't) USMLE scores, school, class rank, honors in ER, MED SURG, others? Whatever you're willing to share. Also if you know of any statistics onthis anywhere. thanks!

maybe you have not been around vey long, but the folks here seem to act like babies when it comes to posting stats.

i'll sum up the typical useless comments:

"man, do you really think that if you don't have a certain score that you stand no chance?!"

"it's not like if you have any of the exact stats that you are going to match"

"i never understand these threads, it's not like it is only a numbers game, there are many other aspects of application"

"has anyone seen my baseball?!"

"this has been discussed ad nauseum and it's not like these things matter"

so now that we have those summed up and got them out of the way, anyone else who would care to post, it would be appreciated. Even if it is just to satisfy curiosities. Thanks.

 

[DrQuinn]

I didn't take the USMLE.
730 on the COMLEX I
Top quintile of my class
HP in the vast majority of my rotations including EM and Surgery.

The one question that does come up and that is more valid, is what LORs did you use?

You should definately do a search for that, but my four were:
Community ED doc at Level 2 Trauma Center
EM Attending at EM Residency
Trauma Surgeon at Level 2 Trauma Center
Pulmonlogist

Q

 

[Sessamoid]

You should definately do a search for that, but my four were:
Community ED doc at Level 2 Trauma Center
EM Attending at EM Residency
Trauma Surgeon at Level 2 Trauma Center
Pulmonlogist

Q

Small correction here.
I know who you mean by the community ED doc, but in actuality (most) all of us at BMC had teaching appointments from USF, though unpaid. Along with the rest of the guys there, I believe my title was "Clinical Instructor" or some thing they gave to people they didn't pay.
My short unpaid stint as an academic...

 

[Short Bus]

University of South Florida
rank: 49/~100
step I: 219 Step II: 244 CS: Pass Wohoo!!
grades: one Pass, 5 High pass. EM, both Honors
LOR's: the two ED's I rotated through and 1 psychiatrist

Ranked my number 1

I was looking for the same thing last year when applying. Feel free to PM me with any questions.

One recommendation I have that I haven't seen posted is when picking places to rotate through during 4th year, pick places with a different atmosphere. For example, do one rotation at a community ER and one at an inner-city ER. This will give you an idea of what you like best

 

[Seaglass]

Yes LOR's are probabbly the most important thing that you can do anything about.

Step 1 235
Step 2 221
Clinicals, 1 or 2 p, most hp, 2-3 honors including EM x HP at away.

LORS: 2 ED res faculty, 1 ED PD, 1 MICU att, all glowing (or so I'm told)

Matched at #1 (also place I did my away) last year.

 

[mvalento]

-NYU School of Medicine
-don't know my class rank (P/F 1st 2 years)
-Honors in Med/OB, High Pass everything else
-honestly don't know what i got in EM rotations (at NYU and HCMC)- all our electives are P/F but there are rumors that you can get honors, i don't know
-Step I 249
-LORs from EM attending at home institution, medicine firm chief, CCU preceptor
-matched at my #1

while these numbers might mean something for getting interviews, i personally feel that the interview day can be quite important- if a certain program "fits" you (you will realize this during interview season), and you can convey this to them, it can really help. best of luck

bud

 

[roja]

Despite type-b attempting trollish posting, if you do a search as to WHY most people get tired of this question is there are many reasons why they are valid statements.


UTHSCSA
67/210
3.6 ish gpa (we have A, B, C, Fail) grading.
LOR from 2 ER docs, one from CCU and one from psych.
Two EM sub-i's.
Step 1- 223
Step 2- 247 (after interviewing so it didn't matter)
Matched #1

One away rotations (already had my LOR's but it was in NYC where I wanted to be which is a small EM community).

Your LOR and doing an away can really help. research where you think you might want to go.

Your stats will help you get an interview, but so does doing an away rotation. And nothing makes up for your interview. I have interviewed people with great stats that were not so great interviewees.

find a place that fits you. this is most important.

 

[MasterintuBater]

Didn't take USMLE
COMLEX I - I don't remember my raw score but it was barely above 50th percentile.
Grades-barely top half of class
Rotations-Mostly honors. Surg, 2 EM Sub-I's,
LORs-3 LORs from EM Attendings whose names carried some weight. 1 Letter from the DME at my base hospital.

Matched at #1 M.D. Program, which I also did an elective EM rotation at.
Most important factors I think helped me match: Good letters, Elective Rotation there.

Good luck

 

[Koko]

One away rotations (already had my LOR's but it was in NYC where I wanted to be which is a small EM community).

Your LOR and doing an away can really help. research where you think you might want to go.

Thanks for sharing. With regard to away rotations, I am interested in NYC, and am having a tough time deciding where to do an away rotation. Any suggestions on how to identify a program and what to consider (in addition to academic vs. comm, 3 vs 4 yr)?

Thanks.

 

[deleted52758]

are we REALLY doing this AGAIN!!?!?!?

 

[deleted52758]

maybe someone can make a sticky or somethhing out of the one that is most complete..-..

 

[ERMudPhud]

maybe someone can make a sticky or somethhing out of the one that is most complete..-..

The last thing I want is everyone's stat's staring me in the face everytime I go to SDN. Anyway...


Columbia P&S
class rank: ?
Step 1: I can't remember and it was so long ago I think it was a different grading scale. One of my interviewers made a sarcastic comment to that effect when I applied for residency. I do remember that I did very well.

Step 2: >230

Honors in Medicine, Peds, Neurology, EM, Med Sub-I, a few meaningless one week rotations in various surgical subs and maybe Psych (I can't remember).

I did one EM rotation at Denver Health and got one letter from there. The other letters where from two medicine attendings.

I also had a PhD in molecular biology and about 10 publications so most places probably would have taken me no matter what the rest of my numbers were. I applied to 10 programs, interviewed at my top 5 and ranked three

 

[mvalento]

koko,

well, i guess everyone is going to be looking for slightly different things in a program though you have already hit upon two of the most important: location (seems you have that one figured already) and 3 vs 4 year. other things that were important to me when i was interviewing:

-how many months of elective time are available? clearly there will be more at the 1-4 programs though some 3 year programs surprised me with how much they fit into their curriculum

-is there a flight program? if so, is it mandatory? (can be a good or bad thing depending on your desire to fly)

-county vs. private vs. mixed practice

-what is the class size? (# of residents at the places i saw ranged from 6-19. i personally prefer a larger class)

-is there an orientation month? (seems like a nice feature to a program)

-what % of graduates get academic positions?

-does the program have a particular area of strength? (e.g. loma linda and international medicine)

other things to consider include research requirements, shift length/frequency during ED months, off service rotations (e.g. the program i matched at (cincy) has no floor months!), and so forth. there are surely other things that i left out which are important to other applicants; these were the things that i considered when ranking programs.

bud

 

[margaritaboy]

Top quater of graduating class
AOA
Step 1: 242
Step 2: 238 (after interviews)
LORs: Two EMs, One FP
Away rotations: none
Matched at my #1

Congrats to those who matched this year!

 

[pushinepi2]

I'm not sure that stats tell the whole picture... I know a couple of pals who did quite well but didn't end up matching. Much like medical school admissions, however, high grades/board scores probably influence the PD's a great deal. I believe (and I'm sure my EM colleagues will correct me if Im wrong) that one of the mainstream EM journals posted something about what matters most to a program director when ranking an applicant. I'll try to find a link to that article and post it here. Anyway...

I didn't take the USMLE
Step I COMLEX: 603/89%
Step II COMLEX: 85% (cant recall raw score)
Rank: 27/211
GPA: 91%
Letters from 2 EM faculty, one at a "community" Emergency Dept
Matched at #2
PH on most clinical rotations

-PuSh

 

[r124c41]

Step 1:224, Step 2:237 ranked 23 programs, matched at #11

 

[Koko]

koko,

well, i guess everyone is going to be looking for slightly different things in a program though you have already hit upon two of the most important: location (seems you have that one figured already) and 3 vs 4 year. other things that were important to me when i was interviewing:

-how many months of elective time are available? clearly there will be more at the 1-4 programs though some 3 year programs surprised me with how much they fit into their curriculum

-is there a flight program? if so, is it mandatory? (can be a good or bad thing depending on your desire to fly)

-county vs. private vs. mixed practice

-what is the class size? (# of residents at the places i saw ranged from 6-19. i personally prefer a larger class)

-is there an orientation month? (seems like a nice feature to a program)

-what % of graduates get academic positions?

-does the program have a particular area of strength? (e.g. loma linda and international medicine)

other things to consider include research requirements, shift length/frequency during ED months, off service rotations (e.g. the program i matched at (cincy) has no floor months!), and so forth. there are surely other things that i left out which are important to other applicants; these were the things that i considered when ranking programs.

bud

Thank you! That is extremely helpful. Congratulations on Cincy and good luck.

One question I have as I try to decide where in NY to do an away elective at is, should I factor in who will write my LOR -- especially if I'm not sure that I want to rank the away elective site ahead of other NY programs?

Are there other things I should be thinking about when selecting an away elective site with the intent to improve my chances of matching in general, not just at the site where I do the elective?

 

[mvalento]

koko,

kind of tough questions there. certainly, if you perform extremely well during an away elective it will really help your chances of matching at that program. however, it also should improve your chances elsewhere, since a good performance should generate a solid LOR which is what program directors really look for in an application.

different programs have different methods of who writes LORs for their students; for instance, at NYU the clerkship director will create a letter from all the feedback he receives from the department staff during your time in the ED- this is provided for anyone who asks for a letter. however, you are also free to ask a particular attending for a letter if you feel it's appropriate (if you have worked with a particular attending for several shifts, have a good rapport, etc).

conversely, the program i visited for an away elective (hennepin) assigns each student a 'mentor' who works several shifts with you; this attending was aware that he/she would be writing a letter for that student on day one of the rotation (provided you are a good student, of course).

my advice for you would be to choose the NYC program that you are most interested in at this point and apply for an elective- i wouldn't worry too much about how this will affect your standing at the programs that you don't choose. program directors realize that you only have a very limited amount of time to spend at other sites. the most important thing is to do well during the elective and get a solid LOR. i was asked about my away elective at many interviews but i never got the feeling that the interviewer was assuming that i really wanted to go there (e.g. "why do you want to come here if you rotated at hennepin?"). they just want to see that you can perform well in the ED, no matter where it is. i matched at a program that i did not rotate at; in fact, all of my friends who matched in EM this year ended up at places that they did not rotate at but ended up ranking higher than those they did electives at.

hope that's not too confusing. one last piece of advice- apply for an away elective early! you don't want to be trying to find open spots during the summer. if you want a letter from your away elective, you'll need to rotate there by september at the latest. good luck!

bud

 

[EPA7X1]

Step I 230
Step 2 CK 249 (but not in time for matchi)
GPA ~3.5
State School with no EM program
LOR from Vandy, Palmetto, IM doc from my JI
Honors EM x 2
Med student NIH fellow (no publication)
Fairly Crappy interviewee
interview offers at 33/35
11/33 done
ranked 11 programs (from all levels of perceived competitiveness)
Extremely F'ing happy in match

 

[jonwilli]

OK, stats mean nothing, but here are mine. I agree that LOR and away rotations make your best chances.

DO applicant, only applied to 3 MD year programs:
Top 20% of my class
Honors/HP on all rotations
COMLEX I 595 (88%)
COMLEX II 94% can't remember raw score
LOR: one PD, one academic faculty, Pulm, Cards (if they are not on faculty somewhere, it won't do you much good unless the Attendings know the person in my opinion)
Applied 33, offered 14 interviews, interviewed at 10, matched at #1

Hope this helps, PM with any particulars. This site prepared me for 100% of my interviews. Do a search on each program, decide where you think you want to go, do at least one outside elective at a teaching program. Remember Jul-Oct fill up quickly and you may need to apply at several places to assure a LOR before they are due. Also apply early as possible, you do not have to have LOR and PS done, and I got interviews before everything was completed

 

[Koko]

koko,

kind of tough questions there. certainly, if you perform extremely well during an away elective it will really help your chances of matching at that program. however, it also should improve your chances elsewhere, since a good performance should generate a solid LOR which is what program directors really look for in an application.

different programs have different methods of who writes LORs for their students; for instance, at NYU the clerkship director will create a letter from all the feedback he receives from the department staff during your time in the ED- this is provided for anyone who asks for a letter. however, you are also free to ask a particular attending for a letter if you feel it's appropriate (if you have worked with a particular attending for several shifts, have a good rapport, etc).

conversely, the program i visited for an away elective (hennepin) assigns each student a 'mentor' who works several shifts with you; this attending was aware that he/she would be writing a letter for that student on day one of the rotation (provided you are a good student, of course).

my advice for you would be to choose the NYC program that you are most interested in at this point and apply for an elective- i wouldn't worry too much about how this will affect your standing at the programs that you don't choose. program directors realize that you only have a very limited amount of time to spend at other sites. the most important thing is to do well during the elective and get a solid LOR. i was asked about my away elective at many interviews but i never got the feeling that the interviewer was assuming that i really wanted to go there (e.g. "why do you want to come here if you rotated at hennepin?"). they just want to see that you can perform well in the ED, no matter where it is. i matched at a program that i did not rotate at; in fact, all of my friends who matched in EM this year ended up at places that they did not rotate at but ended up ranking higher than those they did electives at.

hope that's not too confusing. one last piece of advice- apply for an away elective early! you don't want to be trying to find open spots during the summer. if you want a letter from your away elective, you'll need to rotate there by september at the latest. good luck!

bud

Thank you for the detailed response and helpful advice. After a little more reaearch and having a chance to speak with a couple of people who are familiar with NY programs, I will go ahead and apply.

Good luck to you.

 

[EctopicFetus]

Anyone know when they will say how many people applied to EM this yr?

 

[turtle md]

Like a fart in the wind, here it blows:

Applications to 20
Interviews at 11 (all the ones offered)
Matched #1

Step I - 265
Step II - 249
Grades - majority honors or high pass, with honors in EM
AOA
no rank provided by our school
LOR's from 2 EM (inc. 1 PD and 1 first timer) and 1 IM (who knew me well).

Glad I don't have to bother with this stuff anymore.

Turtle

 

[roja]

koko-

Regarding NYC. Some of thies depends on how strong your application is. If its really competitive (ie good class rank, high board scores, strong LOR's, research) then you will probalby interview at most places in NYC. And where you rotate will become more of an issue of what hospital appeals to you most.

However, if you are a 'medium' applicant or have some 'flaw' (and I use this word with trepidation) then you need to do some significant research and figure out where you are really interested in. An away rotation that you do really well in can completely obliterate any 'flag' in your application. (this happens every year here)

So, go to www.scutwork.com and do a little research (look at what the med students say)

As a med student things you want to look for are:

-dedicated time with an attending. Your subi is going to be much more productive if you are working one on one with an attending instead of a resident.

-in a location that is good for you.

-is at a place that you are interested in.


Check out the EMRA website and figure out what kind of questions appeal to you. Do you want 3 or 4 year.

Do you need to be in manhatten? Do you want a 'down and dirty' county experience? a combination? purely cushy? any and all are available in nyc.

Its also a small small world. Rotate carefully here if you are interested and NEVER say an;ything bad about a program in nyc. the PD's ALL know each other. well.

 

[Koko]

koko-

Regarding NYC. Some of thies depends on how strong your application is. If its really competitive (ie good class rank, high board scores, strong LOR's, research) then you will probalby interview at most places in NYC. And where you rotate will become more of an issue of what hospital appeals to you most.

However, if you are a 'medium' applicant or have some 'flaw' (and I use this word with trepidation) then you need to do some significant research and figure out where you are really interested in. An away rotation that you do really well in can completely obliterate any 'flag' in your application. (this happens every year here)

So, go to www.scutwork.com and do a little research (look at what the med students say)

As a med student things you want to look for are:

-dedicated time with an attending. Your subi is going to be much more productive if you are working one on one with an attending instead of a resident.

-in a location that is good for you.

-is at a place that you are interested in.


Check out the EMRA website and figure out what kind of questions appeal to you. Do you want 3 or 4 year.

Do you need to be in manhatten? Do you want a 'down and dirty' county experience? a combination? purely cushy? any and all are available in nyc.

Its also a small small world. Rotate carefully here if you are interested and NEVER say an;ything bad about a program in nyc. the PD's ALL know each other. well.

I have to say, it's great when people on this board take the time to give substantive advice. Thanks.

While I have done a lot of the things you suggest, including reading a persuasive argument for 3 v 4 yr pgms provided by your PD, I want to talk with a few more people (my advisor and some 4 yrs who are familiary with NY pgms) and do some thinking before making a final decision. It's more important for me since I'm not without flaws (my Mom would be shocked).

Thanks again for your input.

 

[roja]

koko-

No problem. As you get closer, if you have a better idea of what you are looking for (other than location) let me know. I am familiar with the vast majority of the programs in NYC as I interviewed at many of them.

 

[waterski232002]

Preclinical rank - Top third
Clinical rank - Top third
USMLE I - 238
USMLE II - 239
Honors in EM, Neuro, Psych, Research
Pass in all other 3rd year rotations
Research in Acute Mountain Sickness in Nepal

Interviews: all programs I applied except 3
Matched at #1

 

[po' boy]

At Columbia
No class rank, not even close to AOA, 'excellent/outstanding' in Dean's Letter
Step 1 241
Step 2 228 (after I applied so it didn't matter, was never asked for it)
Honors in 1 preclinical class, Peds, and all EM rotations
Outstanding letters of rec from Denver EM, Columbia EM, Columbia Peds EM, and a Catholic priest who teaches/advises at Columbia P&S
Multiple leadership activities on campus all 4 years, including outside employment
Extensive travel history (former writer for Let's Go)
Outstanding personal statement
EM informatics research concurrent with interviews (I gave my interviewers surveys)
Interview very well

Interviews: everywhere I applied (30+ programs)
Matched #1

 

[Koko]

koko-

No problem. As you get closer, if you have a better idea of what you are looking for (other than location) let me know. I am familiar with the vast majority of the programs in NYC as I interviewed at many of them.

Thanks - I will definitely take you up on the offer.

 

[deleted65604]

USMLE I- 242
USMLE II- 235 (didn't take until Feb.)
Class rank- probably top 1/3, I really don't know
clinical in third year- honors in psych (that probably hurt me)
Pass in the rest (we don't have high pass)
Away in ER- high pass at albuquerque
Applied to 33
Turned down 8 interviews
Interviewed at 13
Ranked 12
Matched at #9

I was a little disappointed, but with the 98% positions filled in the match this year, I count myself lucky to have the opportunity to practice ER medicine.

 

[deleted65604]

maybe someone can make a sticky or somethhing out of the one that is most complete..-..

I disagree with this attitude that is so commonly presented on this website. ER was slightly more competitive this year making some past advice no longer applicable. I think it is very relevant, if not vital, information to know for future applicants to gauge their competitiveness. Armed with this knowledge, they can better know how many programs to apply to and to interview at.

I plead with you old-timers to butt out of this thread and let people post their scores and stats for this year. I think people should know best case and worst case scenarios.

 

[waterski232002]

I disagree with this attitude that is so commonly presented on this website. ER just got so much more competitive this year that some past advice no longer applies. I think it is very relevant, if not vital, information to know for future applicants to gauge their competitiveness. Armed with this knowledge, they can better know how many programs to apply to and to interview at.

I plead with you old-timers to butt out of this thread and let people post their scores and stats for this year. Like I said, applying to ER is a lot more competitive.

Agree... I know of at least 4-5 applicants this year that have had board scores >240 with solid applications; however, they did not match in their top 3.... That is crazy!!!

I also know a guy who had board scores in the 230's, good LOR's, and publishable international emergency medicine research, who only got 1 interview out of 15 programs he applied to.... He ended up applying to Anesthesia b/c of the dismal outlook in EM and matched at Mayo (anesthesia)...

More recent information can only help those who follow us...

 

[NinerNiner999]

Agree... I know of at least 4-5 applicants this year that have had board scores >240 with solid applications; however, they did not match in their top 3.... That is crazy!!!

I also know a guy...

Not to butt in here and I hope I'm not considered an "old guy" by interjecting, but this is exactly why I think threads like these with board scores are useless. For every person with a board score higher than 240 who doesn't match, there is a person with a board score below average who did. Who knows what some of these applicants do in their spare time. Sure, an AOA board score higher than 240 sounds impressive, but if they don't have any outside activities, relevent ED experience, or can't interview their way out of a paper bag they will not match. Period. Board scores, grades, etc excluded.

EM is just as competitive now as it has been for the last five years, and the stigma about board scores continues to perpetuate it's difficulty. Look - this field is NOT like orthopedics, radiology, or dermatology, where board scores and dedication soley to medicine and research are the norm for a competitive application. IMO if you are looking at this field as an elitist field and aren't maintaining a well-rounded life outside of the hospital, you have already damaged your application and would probably have a better chance of matching in another field. That's just the way it works... I don't have time to think about whether the person in the trauma bay with me putting in that central line was AOA or scored 240+ on their board. The only thing I worry about is how they work with me and how comfortable I am to work with them. To be truthful, most programs who interview candidates think about the same thing. Then again, it can be tough to be well-rounded in medicine and perhaps that in itself is the most challenging aspect of a successful match in EM.

 

[LC407]

I agree with the previous poster as I am probably a proof of that. I did horribly on Step 1 (<200), 1 honors and rest high passes, no research. Understandably, I was very worried about my lack of competitiveness and hence applied to 50 programs. I received about 12 interviews of which 3 are considered pretty coveted residencies (1 probably courtesy interview). My academic record definitely kept me from receiving interviews from a lot of places, but I was always a believer of things always working out for the best. It's wonderful that all these people on the board did so well in school, but please don't be discouraged if you have average/below-average academic record like me. If you love EM and love what you do, it WILL happen. I ended up matching at my #1. Luck definitely plays a big role.

 

[waterski232002]

Not to butt in here and I hope I'm not considered an "old guy" by interjecting, but this is exactly why I think threads like these with board scores are useless. For every person with a board score higher than 240 who doesn't match, there is a person with a board score below average who did. Who knows what some of these applicants do in their spare time. Sure, an AOA board score higher than 240 sounds impressive, but if they don't have any outside activities, relevent ED experience, or can't interview their way out of a paper bag they will not match. Period. Board scores, grades, etc excluded.

EM is just as competitive now as it has been for the last five years, and the stigma about board scores continues to perpetuate it's difficulty. Look - this field is NOT like orthopedics, radiology, or dermatology, where board scores and dedication soley to medicine and research are the norm for a competitive application. IMO if you are looking at this field as an elitist field and aren't maintaining a well-rounded life outside of the hospital, you have already damaged your application and would probably have a better chance of matching in another field. That's just the way it works... I don't have time to think about whether the person in the trauma bay with me putting in that central line was AOA or scored 240+ on their board. The only thing I worry about is how they work with me and how comfortable I am to work with them. To be truthful, most programs who interview candidates think about the same thing. Then again, it can be tough to be well-rounded in medicine and perhaps that in itself is the most challenging aspect of a successful match in EM.

True... but if everyone just keeps saying that it hasn't changed in the last 5 years (regardless of it has or not), than the people who are asking application/match questions are still in the same boat as before with no new information to look at. Plus, EM is one of the fastest growing fields with multiple new programs opening every year. There's a lot to keep up with and a lot that does change in 5 years.

IMO, I think EM is slightly more competitive than middle of the road. It's not a shoe in for everyone who applies (Family, Medicine, Peds, Neuro), and you still need to be a very competitive applicant to get interviews at some of the more sought after programs (Similar to Anesthesia, Gen Surg). Granted it's not derm, ortho, or neurosurg....

I think out of Anesthesia, Gen Surg, and EM.... Anesthesia is the least competitive, followed by Gen Surg, then EM being most. I think the big difference when applying to EM is that your LOR and EM grade have a TON or weight! Probably much more so than in the other 2 fields. Not having honors in your EM rotation, and not being highly recommended on LORs can really hurt you. And being social and well-rounded is definitely a huge plus.... (whereas in surgery this isn't a big deal, they want you to be a slave!)

 

[Willamette]

I think out of Anesthesia, Gen Surg, and EM.... Anesthesia is the least competitive, followed by Gen Surg, then EM being most. I think the big difference when applying to EM is that your LOR and EM grade have a TON or weight! Probably much more so than in the other 2 fields. Not having honors in your EM rotation, and not being highly recommended on LORs can really hurt you. And being social and well-rounded is definitely a huge plus.... (whereas in surgery this isn't a big deal, they want you to be a slave!)

According to the #'s, for the past two years GS has been FAR MORE competitive than EM.

http://medicine.wustl.edu/~residenc/outside/spec/byspec.html


Willamette

 

[turtle md]

According to the #'s, for the past two years GS has been FAR MORE competitive than EM.

http://medicine.wustl.edu/~residenc/outside/spec/byspec.html


Willamette

how does this figure when em had 24/1188 unfilled (98% fill) while gen surg had 473/2382 unfilled (80% fill). these numbers suggest to me that em is more difficult to get into than gen surg.

 

[EctopicFetus]

Keep in mind the majority of the empty GS spots were prelim spots. To truly compare you have to look at categorical positions. I think EM and Surg are almost equal and Gas is a step below when it comes to competetiveness.

 

[Sessamoid]

how does this figure when em had 24/1188 unfilled (98% fill) while gen surg had 473/2382 unfilled (80% fill). these numbers suggest to me that em is more difficult to get into than gen surg.

Most of those surgery spots unfilled are transitional, not categorical.

 

[EMDocin?]

Have yet to chime in so here goes.

Top student in Foreign Med School, I know, I know but I didn't get in the States the first time around and didn't want to wait another year.

Step I- 245
Step II CK-248
Didn't have to take CS
HP at EM away electives at NYU and U of A
3 EM letters from student clerkship directors and 3rd from EM doc at Level 1 community hospitol
Applied to 70 programs, 10 interviews low probably due to me coming from outside US
Matched at #2

 

[deleted52758]

I disagree with this attitude that is so commonly presented on this website. ER was slightly more competitive this year making some past advice no longer applicable. I think it is very relevant, if not vital, information to know for future applicants to gauge their competitiveness. Armed with this knowledge, they can better know how many programs to apply to and to interview at.

I plead with you old-timers to butt out of this thread and let people post their scores and stats for this year. I think people should know best case and worst case scenarios.

im not an OLD TIMER! hahaha

i know the value of these posts... i was in your position the year before, scurrying to see if anyone did as i did on their boards as i did, and still got a good residency position. i freaked out because it seems like everyone on these boards gets 230-240s. and its ridiculous.

as been said ad nauseaum, dont worry about your score. theres so much more to the game then a number. i had a decent score (213 right around average) and still managed to match at my no 1, which i think is a pretty competitve program.

i guess my advice to you m3s.... use these posts with a grain of salt. not everyone youll be applying with have scores in the 240s with crazy research that was published in the latest emergency medicine journal. there are plenty of normal, average people, like me, who work hard, and get along with people. from what im told by my pd, its because i was so down to earth that the program took a liking to me.

best of luck to all of you who will be starting your EM futures in the upcoming months!

 

[debvz]

how does this figure when em had 24/1188 unfilled (98% fill) while gen surg had 473/2382 unfilled (80% fill). these numbers suggest to me that em is more difficult to get into than gen surg.

Surgery board poster here.... There were 6 categorical spots left open, the rest were prelim.... so 6/1051 spots unfilled (99.4% filled).

 

[Celiac Plexus]

I think out of Anesthesia, Gen Surg, and EM.... Anesthesia is the least competitive, followed by Gen Surg, then EM being most.

I beg to differ... based on NRMP data, general surgery is significantly more competitive than ER. Anesthesia is not competitive at all.


2004 numbers:

Number of unmatched US seniors applying for ER: 70 (% US seniors matched: 93%)

Number of unmatched US seniors applying for general surgery: 201 (% US seniors matched: 81%)

2003 numbers:

Number of unmatched US seniors applying for ER: 36 (% US seniors matched: 96%)

Number of unmatched US seniors applying for general surgery: 175 (% US seniors matched: 82%)

http://medicine.wustl.edu/~residenc/outside/spec/EM_info.html
http://medicine.wustl.edu/~residenc/outside/spec/GS_info.html

These numbers on the WUST web site are from the NRMP data and the general surgery unmatched numbers are the categorical surgery numbers. The 2005 numbers are likely to be even more competitive for general surgery.

Anesthesia continues to be highly uncompetitive. There were 80 unfilled categorical spots this year, with 98% of US seniors successfully matching. For those 80 unfilled spots, the 14 unmatched US seniors got to pick and choose in the scramble.

 

[Trajan]

Agree... I know of at least 4-5 applicants this year that have had board scores >240 with solid applications; however, they did not match in their top 3.... That is crazy!!!

I also know a guy who had board scores in the 230's, good LOR's, and publishable international emergency medicine research, who only got 1 interview out of 15 programs he applied to.... He ended up applying to Anesthesia b/c of the dismal outlook in EM and matched at Mayo (anesthesia)...

To those posting dubious match horror stories: at my school -- a good place, but not a top school by anyone's measure -- 10 of the 125 seniors scored above 240 on step I. Last week a dozen matched EM (since quite a few matched in plastics, ENT, and orthopaedics, odds are most of the EM folks were not among the 10 with 240+ boards. For those who care, the dozen includes people bound for places such as Johns Hopkins, the University of Pittsburgh, and UCLA-Harbor. Last year was the same.

To those who complain about repeat questions on this forum: this is an anonymous website for those who are either seeking information or have information/experiences to share. It is not a club, nor is it a table in a middle school cafeteria. When this forum begins to bore you, take that as a hint that it is time to find something else to do.

 

[waterski232002]

I beg to differ... based on NRMP data, general surgery is significantly more competitive than ER. Anesthesia is not competitive at all.

2004 numbers:

Number of unmatched US seniors applying for ER: 70 (% US seniors matched: 93%)

Number of unmatched US seniors applying for general surgery: 201 (% US seniors matched: 81%)

2003 numbers:

Number of unmatched US seniors applying for ER: 36 (% US seniors matched: 96%)

Number of unmatched US seniors applying for general surgery: 175 (% US seniors matched: 82%)

http://medicine.wustl.edu/~residenc/outside/spec/EM_info.html
http://medicine.wustl.edu/~residenc/outside/spec/GS_info.html

These numbers on the WUST web site are from the NRMP data and the general surgery unmatched numbers are the categorical surgery numbers. The 2005 numbers are likely to be even more competitive for general surgery.

These statistics do not tell the whole story! According to the figures on that website, General Surgery was MORE competitive than Neurosurgery, Orthopedics, Ophthamology, and Radiology in 2003!!!! I don't think so!

Statistics are just numbers and therefore need to be interpreted with other data. To determine a specialties competitiveness off ONLY the number of unfilled spots and % of seniors who went unmatched is inappropriate. You have to factor in the applicant pool and how strong the candidates were who applied. This is the reason that Neurosurg, ortho, radiology, etc were considered Less competitive based on your data (because the weak candidates don't apply to the field b/c they know they won't match, so of the very strong that apply there is a high % match rate... thus it is viewed statistically as "less competitive" even though it is much more competitive than GS)

I don't claim to be "all knowing" or have statistics to back my claim... but based on the people at my school who applied to GS, they were far less competitive (based on class rank and board scores) than the EM candidates and they interviewed and matched at similar programs. The people I know who had similar scores in EM did not get the interviews that the GS applicants got. Obviously this is just an observation and I'm sure the opposite was true at many other schools, but I think it would be safe to say that GS and EM are for the most part pretty similar when it comes to competitiveness. There's no way to tell the whole story, and certainly the statistics on that website do not.

 

[turtle md]

I guess the important question is:

Who would WANT to do GS when EM is an option. Maybe it's just me, but I don't think so...

 

[hello23]

we determine surgeon's life, especially at 5:50am. period.